Which is worse: keeping our dirty laundry secret so we can proclaim we are the finest in the land or stop the abuses, but tarnish our image?
In Van Buren’s case, it was perhaps all those late nights on some desolate base thousands of miles from his family, thinking about the mad way your taxpayer money was being squandered — millions of dollars, for instance, going into the building of an all-Iraqi chicken-plucking factory that would never be used to pluck chickens.
[…]
Though the Obama administration has, from its first days, talked the talk of governmental openness and “sunshine,” it’s walked a very different walk. And while Van Buren hasn’t, like other whistleblowers, been brought to court or imprisoned, he has learned, once again in an up close and personal fashion, how little “our” government wants even a penlight shown on its inner workings.
Which Van Buren?
Really? After reading the linked article you don’t know?
Government is the omnipresent teacher. Make no mistake, the little backscratchers in all the little local governments are hearing well the lessons being broadcast from Washington by Obama’s backscratchers.
Pros and Cons to all we do. If we keep secrets, if we don’t keep secrets. What should the divining rod be? Power to the status quo, the rich, or the truth or the people? Every judgment/action taken is apportioned among those interests and many others, all rolling along.
You’d think that at least hypocrisy should be avoided? But surely pros and cons there as well. Should we go down in flames, cut by being forthright in a world of intrigue, self interest, and lies/diplomacy to get there?
Oh verily–its a swamp and we are in waist deep.
Still–I think we could do better?===a little nudge towards honesty and transparency and see what happens?
Manning is more right than wrong regardless of his personal motives. The Truth.
Get Him!!!!!!
Okay. What about this surprises anyone? That the Obama admin is two faced and utterly lacking in the values it professes to support? We’ve had the better part of three years to figure this out. This is what people should expect from this administration.
Don’t vote for him again. The first time may have been an honest mistake but the next time is going to be you siding with the devil.
And the last admin and the one before that and the one before that and the one before that, rinse and repeat.
They are ALL like that.
Why? Because they are all the same beastie. Just one has stripes and one has spots, but same breed.
And it will not end no matter how many times we vote one side in or the other. We know this from history.
It is time for a clean slate. A new republic. One that is for a modern world.
But no one will do that. Because they are too lazy. It is too hard and would require too much of their drink and TV time.
So we will end up like the UK and then Spain.
Former glory and now shit.
Cursor_
Doill–its the very partisanship that you express that keeps the secrecy, and the need for whistleblowers, alive.
The problems discussed are not caused by one party or the other, nor will they be solved by throwing one party out in favor of the other party.
Its power corrupting those who hold it, and keeping that power by appealing to idiots like you.
Find the issue and stay focused on it. Apply your new found wisdom to BOTH PARTIES.
Yea, verily.
I have a travel trailer and a place to park it that no one can find. Bambi lives there too, so I’m set. I’ll expect the feds to knock down my door tomorrow, no I’m not kidding.
Land of the free. The joke is on you.
Just what I expected from Obama. All the rhetoric about transparency and ending wars plus the demise of Gitmo has been lies. Obama didnt end the Iraqi quagmire. Boots still in Afghanistan.
The hope and change is now a hope he’s voted out and change in your pocket. Although the boobs running against Obama are so nutty, one has to stop and wonder if America is drawing it’s final breath, as Greece the birthplace of Democracy is burning.
Fucking depressing situation.
You mean we’d might do better picking the names of our representatives out of a hat?
jp–I’ll take a jump here and say I think we share many values in common? With that as a premise, I think we are both to the left of Obama as were maybe half the people who voted for him before?
We progressives libs are all dissappointed in Obama==he being too much G. Bush Lite.
I did hear him say that he would need to be pushed to do the right thing==and he’s living up to that.
So–compared to perfect, he really stinks. But is that the real/pragmatic choice we have before us? When we step into the ballot booth, don’t we know that while Obama could be so much better, every other contestant right now is measurably worse.
As always, I find myself not voting “for” someone but against all the other buffoons. Do you spy something else of value that justifies your “vote him out” rhetoric?
Who are you for? Why?
Anyone? ((Ha, ha===yes its a trap because all the Pukes are Goons. Demonstrably Worse than Obama===all more like the worst parts of Bush??? I didn’t think that was possible, but there it is!))
Sorry–I’m starting to forget just what a pile of crap Bush handed off to Obama.
Maybe he’s the best that could ever be as “any” democrat opposed by the Hate America First crowd of the GOP Teapublicans of today.
How long does anyone think the Teapublicans will last as a stranglehold on the puke party?
My over/under mark is 4 more years.
Bobbo: “dissappointed [sic] in Obama==he being too much G. Bush Lite.”
Actually, I think he’s been worse for the country than Bush. I don’t recall Bush ever promising unprecedented transparency and then choosing to meet with lobbyists off the premises of the WH so they wouldn’t be recorded in the guest book.
Of course, Bush did charge a lot of people under the Espionage Act – oh, wait – that’s O’Bama. (“The Obama administration has already charged more people … under the Espionage Act for alleged mishandling of classified information than all past presidencies combined.”)
Maybe, when we march into Iran late this summer, you’ll start being realistic and call GWB. O’Bama lite.
BTW, Bobbo: Couple of days ago you feigned fury at me for using the appellation: Bobbette. Yet, above, you refer to Deowll as doill and yesterday Pedro as pedobear. Lord knows how many other less than kind nicknames you’ve applied.
Hypocrite much?
Despite Obama’s disastrous foreign policy and desperation to surrender in Afghanistan, he has at least prosecuted leakers, even going after the John Kerry staffer who leaked to the New York Times.
False hope and chump change vs. Magic Underwear.
Yeah, that two-party “system” is really working out well…..
Animby Starts Playing Possum and says:
2/13/2012 at 4:20 am
Bobbo: “dissappointed [sic] in Obama==he being too much G. Bush Lite.” //// I never used [sic] in my statement. Is that needed for quoted material? So, we’re gonna start at that level huh?
Actually, /// sic?–you posted you hated that word, but you use it here? I think that is emblamatic of what you do to much of. You are better than that. I’m only here to remind you from time to time of your better self.
I think he’s been worse for the country than Bush. I don’t recall Bush ever promising unprecedented transparency and then choosing to meet with lobbyists off the premises of the WH so they wouldn’t be recorded in the guest book. /// Thats because BushtheRetard was only a meat puppet. I assume once mentioned you will recall Cheney meeting with all the oil Barrons ((sic???–that is latin for fish bait right?)) I think on Government Property during working hours and refusing to any details at all and when sued he claimed he wasn’t part of the Executive Branch? I’d repress that bit of skulduggery too. Hard to believe any politician of any stripe would do that. Can’t blame Bush for that though as they both directly serve the People! Tons of other examples none so outrageoous ((sic)) or well prublicized. ((sick))
Of course, Bush did charge a lot of people under the Espionage Act – oh, wait – that’s O’Bama. (“The Obama administration has already charged more people … under the Espionage Act for alleged mishandling of classified information than all past presidencies combined.”) /// Gee, I’d think that was a good thing? The key role of the Feds being to protect this country? Recall BushtheRetard saying he wasn’t all that concerned about Osama? GOD he is Retarded!!! Have I mentioned that? Oh—-my crystal balls say you imply these arrests are against innocent people?==Got any detailed list of that? Link? No?==just mud?
Maybe, when we march into Iran late this summer, you’ll start being realistic and call GWB. O’Bama lite. /// I’ll bet you dollars to pilfered aspirin that never happens. More mud. He had his chance in Egypt, Libya, now Syria. His social program is more at risk with unbridled military adventures. Leave it to the fly boys off land and ships.
BTW, Bobbo: Couple of days ago you feigned fury at me for using the appellation: Bobbette. Yet, above, you refer to Deowll as doill and yesterday Pedro as pedobear. Lord knows how many other less than kind nicknames you’ve applied.
Hypocrite much? //// I have to assume you know what feigned means? Short attention span much?
Ha, ha. Animby===you concern me. I find substantive confrontation to be but the same fun and interest as an exchange of poetry, jokes, and other word play yet you are taking a turn towards the hurt feelings. I have been scathing towards do-ill and dismal for years and both are becoming more friendly. PedoBear goes unfazed.
Whats the Beef? Just say the word, and I’ll back completely off. Treat you with the deference you seem to require? I guess you would still be worth reading after that but how would you handle a charge of hypocrisy yourself given the light chiding you do give out?
I’ve told you why I am only since Bush voting Dumbo. I was detailed in my justification for challenging your advocating for the Pukes and you respond only with silence, delay, and rebuke.
Surely you’ve got more? I like being challenged. You wouldn’t be as smart as you are if at sometime in your youth you didn’t like it too? But then, you are Republican—so, maybe so.
Lazy thoughts.
Animby==you say: “Feign? Why yes, I do know what it means. If you were not feigning anger at the gentle name tugging, then I lose respect for you.” /// The more relevant subject that the referenced comment was aimed at was the charge of hypocrisy.
And to sharpen further a later allusion, let me modify: “Thats the kind of “severe REPUBLICANISM ” that marks STUPIDITY.” Much closer to Romney and his pandering now although it should have been clear enough as written.
don’t you find everything we write is only a very rough first draft? I am always more clever two days later.
We teach our children to be open and honest and to tell us if someone does something bad. Then they get to grow up and learn to turn a blind eye, ignore and lie because it’s socially wrong to out anyone or anything and if they don’t they are labeled as a snitch or in this case whistleblower. And you would think that everyone as good little Christians would stand behind these few brave individuals that tell the truth.
Where is the incentive to do anything right?
duh365 says:
2/13/2012 at 9:53 am
We teach our children to be open and honest and to tell us if someone does something bad. /// More specifically “bad to them” so that revenge may be taken. Few teach their kiddies to tell when someone does something bad to SOMEONE ELSE. That wouldn’t be a team player, plus as every good religious kiddie is taught: maybe the other people “deserved” what happened to them.
Then they get to grow up and learn to turn a blind eye, ignore and lie because it’s socially wrong to out anyone or anything and if they don’t they are labeled as a snitch or in this case whistleblower. /// No. They get FIRED, not promoted, or transferred.
And you would think that everyone as good little Christians would stand behind these few brave individuals that tell the truth. /// No–just the opposite. Besides, its rare in whistleblower cases that many know “what the truth is.” Allegations? Sure. But the truth?
Our society is the way it is because of the rules/real world consequences/and who we are as people. Not a corruption of what we were taught.
Where is the incentive to do anything right? //// A few people get fed up enough to do what they think is the right thing. Real Christians, those who were raised to be honest as the priority, are few and far between.
…No–just the opposite. Besides, its rare in whistleblower cases that many know “what the truth is.” Allegations? Sure. But the truth?
/// Maybe not the full truth or picture but typically the opposite of a corporation’s / government’s official press release.
Our society is the way it is because of the rules/real world consequences/and who we are as people. Not a corruption of what we were taught.
/// It’s one and the same.
If you have a security clearance and violate that clearance you need to be in JAIL PERIOD.
Every dictatorship would agree with you. Public servants (government employees) often sign a NDA or a state secrecy act, which all too often conceals criminal activity from the public.
Even soldiers do not have to obey an unlawful order!
Bobbo: “I am always more clever two days later.” Ahh. I understand. I often find the brilliant idea mere seconds after clicking on the submit button. Therein lies the beauty of not being able to edit the comments: There are only 24 hours in a day!
As to your previous replies to me, I would love to sit down with you and buy you a latte or even a beer and discuss them fully. You have some very valid points. Not many, but some. The only thing I will address right now is my registered Democrat status. A youthful indiscretion, I suppose. Like most teenagers, I had high ideals and revulsion for the Establishment. So, when I became eligible to register, I chose the party that most closely matched those ideals: Demo. These days, I still hold that dubious membership even though I have about as much faith to either Demo or Repub as I do to either Catholicism or Islam.
When I moved to Texas and re-registered, the form offered me three choice for political affiliation: Demo, Repub or Independent. I would have preferred “None of the Above” but ticked the Dem box.
Your past is garden variety–supposedly we are all supposed to be more liberal in our youth. My education engaged me to continue reading, observing, thinking, learning which has driven me to become even more liberal.
shows like “Slavery by another Name” on PBS right now: labor by peonage as practiced in post reconstruction times with arguably a continuing today with for profit jail systems.
RICH = CRIMINAL. Easy debating point to win. All the facts and statistics point to it. What else are current Puke social policies all about except forcing the non rich into working wage slavery?
Animby—take comfort however you do but it your future voting that counts politically, and your politcal posting you do right now, here.
The few times I have parsed you, you have failed to establish any valid facts upon which to vote Puke. Not a few, not speaking hyperbolically==you have never stated a valid fact. Must be emotional then? There has been a twist to your development somehow. I could guess at that, but it would only be a shot in the dark. 3 divorces could make anyone misanthropic which is indistinguishable from being Puke even while as stated the first is emotional while the second is political.
While I criticize the profession ((Rich = Criminal)) by a large margin I have found physicians, lawyers, physicists, writers, cabinet makers, and back woods packers to be fine and admirable individuals. More thoughtful than most. Often they will talk the talk of conservative but when pushed finally admit to liberal values. What else is caring for the sick?
cognitive dissonance. What what thinks/experiences/knows/empathizes with what falls into the habit of lazily thinking and saying.
A push is as good as a skewer. Pay attention Animby==whenever you are ready. Go to CageMatch and take me to task on the Republican Thread. One of us can’t hold his argument. I’m looking at you.
Bobbo:
I’m at the clinic but enjoying a bowl of som tam. I don’t know how the patient’s put up with my breath!
In any case, pardon the brief reply. Misanthrope? You must be kidding. Oh, hyperbolic. You’re throwing me a curve? I would guess in my lifetime, I have donated my services at least a thousand times for each time I have charged. I have literally gone years without charging a fee for my services.
And, even when I am employed, I seldom make anything like what I could earn in private practice in the USofA. You attached that appellation to my three failed marriages. Perhaps you meant misogynist? That would have been incorrect, too. Ask either of my lady friends. Just don’t get them together to do it!
“RICH = CRIMINAL” I am not a debatist but I think you could lose that point. In fact, when you go on to make it sound like the Right wing policies encourage it, I just have to ask you who the two richest people in the US are and what party do they support? Even in the Congress, there are more rich (D) than (R) members.
There’s a fact, for you.
Please note: I did NOT say “fact you”!
PS I gotta get a portable keyboard for my Tab. Even with Shapewriter, I get tired of finger typing.
PPS You will not see me on Cage Match or any other forum. The only other forums I belong to are for medics. There is only so much time in a day for this nonsense.
Bobbo defends the status quo based on political party.
Priceless.
HM–how so? I said lets try to nudge the system towards more honesty and transparency. What language did you prefer to fixate on instead?
But in a vacuum until you fill it with your usual, Yes==the status quo is preferable to every soul destroying middle class destruction out right warfare the Pukes would impose on us 99 per centers for their Masters.
Why do you advocate your own destruction MH? You can see others struggling/worse off than you==but you vote against your own self interest as a victim of class warfare that you only promulgate. You’ll be dismayed if you ever recognize it.
Ha, ha.
A friend just emailed me a joke. I usually hate that but …
A Liberal, a Conservative and a Moderate walk into a tavern.
The bartender says, “Hi, Mitt!”
Sending our rich to jail is seriously pro-global-democracy.
My friends in the developing world have told me they admire this about the democratic west. In their countries the rich literally get away with murder.
Nothing helps global democracy movement more than to see obviously law breakers like Dick Cheney or Rupert Murdoch to be marched off in handcuffs.
But it guys like that stay free, it makes democracy a fraud in the world’s eyes.
That is an excellent reminder/caution/dare I say lament about what I consider to be one of Obama’s worst failures: no one prosecuted, re-regulation not done, current pronouncement a tale told for fools as the Statute of Limitations has run on so much of the activities==unless fraud would toll the statute from running. Takes someone who really cares for that to happen. I don’t see that in Washington these decades.
Thanks.
A long, long, very long time ago you still had investigative journalists protecting a democracy against big government. Those days are gone. These days you only have some dude out there becoming a whistleblower every once in a while. Instead of investigating, they immediately focus on the person and try to chop their head off. And the big government does everything in it’s power to shut up those potential whistleblowers before they even blow the whistle. They are usually really bad for (government) business. If you still think you live in a democracy, think again. Or when not capable of that anymore, just keep watching the propaganda on your tv as usual. Your government will honestly explain it to you.
The police state isn’t coming, it’s here already.
I’m not entirely sure what this article is about. But what I gather, is this. That even pointing out wasteful mistakes made by the US government (Congress as well as White House) , is a breach of national security, punishable by some retaliation. Despite something called the Whistleblower Protection Act of 1989. Which obviously is a huge joke. An Enhanced Act was proposed in 2009, but nothing has yet passed in the US Congress. Even weakened versions of it, haven’t passed. Congress is real good at making sure nobody else gets a fair deal, but the members of Congress.