Our Fearless Leader
Paul Craig Roberts: How New Orleans Was Lost — This article, although extremely biased and anti-Bush does make some good points. It’s when I saw Bush “surveying” the damage from inside his 747 at high altitude instead of actually being Presidential and going down there and seeing the situation from the ground that I decided to link to this article.
Chalk up the city of New Orleans as a cost of Bush’s Iraq war.
There were not enough helicopters to repair the breeched levees and rescue people trapped by rising water. Nor are there enough Louisiana National Guards available to help with rescue efforts and to patrol against looting.
The situation is the same in Mississippi.
The National Guard and helicopters are off on a fools mission in Iraq.
The National Guard is in Iraq because fanatical neoconsevatives in the Bush administration were determined to invade the Middle East and because the incompetent Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld refused to listen to the generals, who told him there were not enough regular troops available to do the job.
After the invasion, the arrogant Rumsfeld found out that the generals were right. The National Guard was called up to fill in the gaping gaps.
Now the Guardsmen, trapped in the Iraqi quagmire, are watching on TV the families they left behind trapped by rising waters and wondering if the floating bodies are family members. None know where their dislocated families are, but, shades of Fallujah, they do see their destroyed homes.
The mayor of New Orleans was counting on helicopters to put in place massive sandbags to repair the levee. However, someone called the few helicopters away to rescue people from rooftops. The rising water overwhelmed the massive pumping stations, and New Orleans disappeared under deep water.
What a terrible casualty of the Iraqi war–one of our oldest and most beautiful cities, a famous city, a historic city.
Distracted by its phony war on terrorism, the US government had made no preparations in the event Hurricane Katarina brought catastrophe to New Orleans. No contingency plan existed. Only now after the disaster are FEMA and the Corp of Engineers trying to assemble the material and equipment to save New Orleans from the fate of Atlantis.
Even worse, articles in the New Orleans Times-Picayune and public statements by emergency management chiefs in New Orleans make it clear that the Bush administration slashed the funding for the Corp of Engineers’ projects to strengthen and raise the New Orleans levees and diverted the money to the Iraq war.
“wonder about the assertion that the French are responsible. The old French Quarter is one of the few parts of town built at sea-level. Maybe a local can explain to us what happened. Out West we use land fill for expansion rather than just dike off the area. Less long term maintenance.”
The mouth and flow of any river changes over time. As the current flows it deposits silt. When people built along the river beds they had to prevent the river from it’s natural changes. Therefore, the area of New Orleans was built on silt that (as it dries) compacted and sank further under sea level. The sinking necessitated levees to prevent flooding. The leeves continually need to be built up as the area sinks. They were 18 foot already.
The real problem here is the idiocy of building a city there. If they had any brains they would not rebuld there. But, they will. They will build huge leeves and challenge mother nature again. They will lose again too.
good thread.. roberts could be right about every bit of his rant or totally wrong but the fact is this: anything bush did or didnt do wouldnt have changed ONE thing… the problems on the ground there are manifold: new orleans is a soup bowl thats been turned into a cess pool with noway for the water to escape and it is one of our poorer and if you may… sleezer citys. this is a man made disaster alright but not one on one mans making. there is no excuse for the looting.. the effort to steal would at this time be better put to use helping ppl out of harms and as a country we use to know that..
the incredible thing to my mind is now like after 9/11 we are looking on in disbelief that this is happening to us… these things dont happen in america… well they do when things go on and on without being addressed… like poverty and joblessness.. putting all the blame on an escape goat makes us feel better but it never solves the problems.
just makes me wonder where the high tech future is that was promised us in the sixties… the maglev trains, the electric cars, a power grid running coast to coast, LED lights, the geo dome weather proof buildings. jobs and jobs and more jobs… since we put a man on the moon in ’69 this country has not endeavered to do anything of substance but to money grub and whine when things dont go our way… when you view new orlean and this man made disaster that was brought on by hurricane katrina ask not for whom the bells toll.. it tolls for thee….
If anything comes out of this it will be new government regs that prohibit building in such a flood prone area. New Orleans should not be rebuilt.
First, I agree with many of the statements within these posts.
If I’m not mistaken It was pirates, the Spanish, and the French (Einstiens all) that started New Orleans, and with population growth, expanded the city placing it under sea level.
All the indicators pointed to a killer storm, predicting thousands dead after words, as reported by all the news media. Warnings from the mayor to evacuate were ignored – yet, Mr. Bush’s fault?
The media, who has no problem getting in or out, provides a marvelous service: allowing me to watch these miserable, wretched people suffer. If it bleeds; it leads, and pointing out all thats going wrong as they slip away when situations goes out of control. Only once, I saw a report where the journalist gave directions to one guy how to get to a safer area.
Maybe these gangs of entitlement will resist the National Guards who will deal with them as the animals they’ve become.
I can’t remember how long before our govenment was helping the tsunami victims, do you?
How many foreign nations’ ships are steaming to our aid? Their planes, helicoptors: Have you seen them?
Finally, science has proven that conservatism caused this storm.
Paul Theodoropoulo wrote:
isn’t it wonderful how much money the telethons in europe have accumulated to aid their fellow human beings in their great time of need? Isn’t it extraordinary that the search and rescue teams from switzerland and malaysia and the congo are in new orleans now, helping us with this natural disaster?
oh. wait. sorry, i must have been dreaming.
I see that Iraq vets are being shipped in to help restore order.
I hope to god not, but that has disaster stamped all other it – twitchy armed troops facing starving refugess who won’t look anything like the americans they’re used to. If they get rushed by the refugees then all it takes is one shot to start a massacre.
Silly me. Here I thought we were talking about a natural disaster. I should have know this, like all other topics to the left, is really about the war.
The concept of a Presidential visit is not at issue; its the logistics that are in question. How do you get the leader of the nation into and out of a disaster area safely while the situation is still in flux, with the majority of people being moved out. Further, to think that such an act needs to be taken, by a leader of any stripe, to show he is ‘thinking’ is a joke. Everyone is thinking about this. What needs to happen are actions. Knock the guy on that front, because after five days ‘slow’ seems to be the keyword of the week.
(And long term, we need to see some real disaster recovery planning done by the Homeland Security Dept.)
I’m not rejecting your thinking of Bush showing some heart in the matter. I am, correctly, rejecting your idea because it is only an attempt to knock the guy… not solve any problems.
In the end it’s not really about common conservative or liberal thought. Its about those on the left trying to paint the worst possible picture because they have no other rocks to throw in the grand political argument.
faustus
Your hi-tech future was prostituted in the name of oil profits.
If we had spent half of what’s being pissed away in Iraq starting in 1975, we’d be in great electric cars and efficient homes.
This one I blame on DUHBYA. – sorry, couldn’t resist. 🙂
Actually all of us are to blame for not seeing the writing on the wall in 75. I hope this recent set of events starts us in investing in non-oil derived transportation and non-polluting electric generation.
Bunk!
Of the 1,012,000 soldiers on active duty and in the Reserves or National Guard. Only 261,000 are deployed overseas. There are 103,000 soldiers in Iraq. That’s about 10.2% of the Army!
Where does this c**p come from. Don’t listen to it!
thats why i dont take much stock in liberal whining.. how long do you think it would have taken roosevelt to have put in a fair health care plan in place, how long would it have taken kennedy to put in a clean, nationally self-sufficient, transportation program together, similar to nasa, that used caltech to hep design and build electric cars, lawrence livermore to develop and manage a national power grid fed with alaskan natural gas thats currently just being burnt off into the atmosphere, mit to develop mass transit plan. how long do you think roosevelt, turman, marshall would put up with those mulas calling for terrorist suicide acts??? we’d be still be fighting the japanese if they would have put up with that sh*t. as long as we dont demand anything from our own so called leaders its pretty hard to expect much from the republicans who for the most part are still who they have always been, protectionist for the rich.
Roosevelt? Who the fuck is Roosevelt? Is he still around? What’s your point? What the heck does Roosevelt got to do with anything? What planet are you from?
In reading through this thread the most interesting comments to me are the ones from Jerry regarding where the city is located.
Does anyone know the last major city to be reloacted (ever)? I know Valdez was moved after the 9.0 earthquake in Alaska, but that’s about two city blocks compared to NO.
Shouldn’t Bush be focusing on the war instead of some hurricane?
Boston would have had a similar problem, except they actually raised the land rather than build below sea level.
Re: Rebuilding
Contrary to my usual feeling, this is the one city and area of the country where “common sense” will not and should not win out.
The city is hundreds of years old, with roots and traditions that go back just as long. The French, Creole, and African American traditions, Mardi Gras, Voodoo. Jazz was born there. Plus the history of the Cajuns in the local bayou, who were relocated from eastern Canada during the French and Indian war 250 years ago. Fascinating. One of the truly unique places in this country.
This has happened before and will happen again. The people will rebuild and go on. They wouldn’t have it any other way and neither should we.
On the other hand, I wouldn’t object to them filling in some of the deeper parts of the city — which ironically are more recent — and rebuilding on top of that. The modern houses with water up to their roofs must be completely rebuilt (drywall and wood frames), and you might as well do that at sea level, in order to reduce the area that must be protected with levees. (Of course they could still be flooded by a couple feet, which would be unacceptable. So they’d still demand protection.)
The older areas like the French Quarter were built with rock and brick to withstand just such flooding, and were only flooded by 2-5 feet. They’ll hardly smell any different after the flood than before.
Couple months of drying out and they’ll be back in business. I’m sure next Mardi Gras will be much smaller, but it will go on as before.
AB CD
How can duhbya focus on the war when he has proven himself incapable of doing so?
He needs to be impeached.
Hey I have a joke – how can you tell when the neocons are lying? They open their mouths!
Mr. Dvorak,
As a person living in the area hit by hurricane Katrina (not New Orleans thank God) I take issue with your comments that:
“It’s when I saw Bush “surveying” the damage from inside his 747 at high altitude instead of actually being Presidential and going down there and seeing the situation from the ground that I decided to link to this article.”
The last thing we need here is Bush and his security detail screwing things up worse than they are. We have enough politicians on the ground whoring for the cameras. We need Bush to do his job and to see to it that this part of the country recovers as soon as possible.
For the record, I am a Libertarian who did not vote for Bush.
Shane A. Taylor, Esq.
P.S. You are all doing a great job on “This week in Tech”. I look forward to each new episode. Good luck with the live broadcasts.
Faustus, do you remember Truman getting bogged down in Korea? He left office with a very low approval rating after losing China to the Communists and letting them help the North Koreans fight us.
Let’s look past the fact a hurricane is a natural disaster. We knew it was strong and we knew it would hit the U.S. Regardless of which exact city was going to get the eye and which cities would be damaged, WE KNEW IT WAS COMING. Emergency supplies should have been on-hand and ready to deploy as soon as the weather was safe enough to get into affected areas. Wether it is south florida or louisana or texas or the east coast we usually have about a weeks notice before these storms hit land. I say let mayor Nagin run for president. A politician that actually goes through the same suffering as his community. A politician willing to say he doesn’t care if he gets in trouble, just begging for people to help those in need, and in the end thats what really matters. No Mr. Bush isn’t to blame for the storm that hit the gulf coast, just for the lives that could have been saved had he maybe not needed to get in that last round of golf. Poor guys having their vacations cut short to deal with biggest disaster to befall U.S. soil. I just find it heartbreaking that most of the people I have talked to the majority of the people who care about this loss of life are the poor who are willing to share what meger things we have, opening our homes to refugees and offering nothing more than fresh water, a shower and a safe place to sleep, while the rich are either to good to help or ignore this crisis altogether. Guess it just goes to prove that no good deed goes unpunished.
Good luck Shane – I’ll have you in my thoughts and prayers.
president bush is a disgrace,
we need more help here in the southeast now!!!!
the goverment needs to send the military to help the thousands of people that are in need. these people need the basic necessities., food , water, bathrooms, clean place to put their children the eldery to sleep at night, medical help. why can’t these simple things be provided?
why is the military in the middle east helping them have these simple necessities and not here in the great united states of america.
these people are getting desperate and they start doing desperate things to provide for their loved ones.
president bush get your act together and start doing the right thing her in __our__ great country and forget about the oil in the middle east.
These people need your help now!!!!
I agree with Robert Nichols. But I accordingly suffer being equated to a side-taker in doin’ so. Honestly, who cares about the sins of the past right now? We have a catastrophe in our own backyard that must be more than addressed. I am a National Guardsman activated and stationed at Fort Irwin, CA, whose present duties are to train incoming units for desert warfare in Iraq (and elsewhere). Here is my quick and painless recommendation: the Army should cancel the next two “rotations” into Fort Irwin, send the units that were scheduled to train in the next two rotations to the battered South to do whatever it takes to assist (build tent cities, hand out supplies, dig ditches etc). On top of that, my National Guard unit should be taken off of Title 10 status and returned to Title 32 status to enable our involvement in the South in a quasi-law enforcement capacity (thereby getting past posse comitatus) or as ditch diggers, whatever the case need be. As I see it, there should be Five-Tons and every other form of military transport filing into the battered areas and areas of evacuation in convoys of heretofore unheard of magnitude. THIS was the idea of just one person to alleviate some of a major national problem…me.
Now all that needs to happen is others, perhaps you reading this, to each come up with an idea and attempt to realize it. I spoke to my Commanding Officer about mine, and he, being the bureaucrat that he is, told me all the reasons why it is unfeasible (not one option on how to amend my proposal for feasibility). That is really no different than the Left- and Right-bashing that goes on here and on other blogs…America suffers from an identity problem, always taking on the “us against them” stance, rather than uniting as one proud country.
Kurt Vonnegut once wrote, “History: read it and weep.” I think alot of weeping needs to take place, so that we can all remember the horrid outcomes of such pointless side-taking, and perhaps remember the strong, defensible ideology and esprit de corps upon which this country was established…
…but until then y’all will just continued to back or bash Bush, and unleash mere hot air that could otherwise be helpful action.
I really think all of you talking heads are a disgrace to this country. The Military in Iraq enlisted, they were not drafted and they knew what they wanted to do with their lives. The people in New Orlenas were warned to evacuate and chose to ignore the warning. New Orleans was given money by the Federal Government to fix the levees, but why should they? They could pork barrel that money away. A hurricane would never breech their levees. The government did not cause this natural diaster, and it takes a little time to get the man and machine power to help these poor people in New Orlens, but remeber, that was not the only place that was hit by devestation. Why do we forget Alabama and Mississippi? They too need our help. I am so ashamed of all these people that want to blame.
Writers can make their point clearly without superlatives, without insulting leaders and without adjectives designed to discredit those trying to make a difference. I am sure with the extensive knowledge that Mr. Roberts possesses about the financial commitments of the United States Governement , of the State of Louisiana and specifically New Orleans, there are other areas of expenditures that could and should have been targeted rather than to place the blame fully on the War on Terrorism that is ongoing in Iraq. When a city makes a commitment to build its infrastructure below sea level with such close proximity to the water itself, judgement must called into question. Writers, journalists, politicians and people look ridiculous pointing fingers as who is to blame, rather than focusing on solving the problems at hand and trying to prevent it from happening again. Mandatory evacuation means only one thing and that is to leave and to leave immediately. If persons fail to obey, to heed or to follow such an executive order, maybe Mr. Roberts can take a brief sabbatical from writing this column and offer transportation to those who indeed are the motivation and the subject of this “piece”.
just shut your mouth up!
wow this site really helped me in my project for hurricanes! thanks~ what does “dvvorak uncensored” mean?