Dow Down 500 Points as House Rejects Bailout – Market Overview – CNBC.com
So let me get this straight. The “free” market as represented by the Dow-Jones and the NYSE falls through the floor because the US Government did not vote in a program that would represent government control of a free market. What is wrong with these people?
The market screamed as the House vote on the Wall Street bailout bill teetered on the edge of a cliff — and then fell off.
The bill initially failed to get enough votes, sending the market into a tailspin, as congressmen and women huddled to try to shore up the votes to save it. To no avail: The bill was ultimately rejected, leaving the future of the bailout in question.
The Dow Jones Industrial Average fell 701.93 at one point
#118:
Puhleze. I’m not pulling a “stunt.” I’m simply asking for some damn proof.
If you did talk to those economists, fine. I hope you did, because then your information is better than mine, and I’ll place a higher value on what you have to say, which is really your reason for saying:
“[I] have spoken with many of them about this issue. You might be surprised how many things they agree with me on.”
which is bullshit unless I know it’s true. Simple.
I’m not trying to “prove” anything, and I’m really not taking this personally, even though you’ve called me a “dipshit” and a “dolt” and an “asshat.”
I apologize if I’m bothering people with this, but I’m just trying to counter someone attacking my information with: BUT I TALKED TO THOSE GUYS AND YOU DIDNT JUST BELIEVE IT!!
J==mustard is right. Don’t post your name here. Mustard did it a few months ago and I’ve been googling him ever since just for fun. ( Oh! )
Mustard==yes you did and you were a prince to do so.
brm==if its “fun” I guess so. J does take the bait fairly easily. Absent the fun, the appeal to authority is very easily ignored.
Typical knife fight, no rules. But at least I got to kick Mustard in the nuts.
#124 bobbo:
You’ll notice that I just respond to him. If he said “no, I’m not proving it.” or “jeez, I really don’t have any good proof on hand, so I can’t” without totally freaking out and calling me names, I’d have dropped it.
Anyways, J is right that the letter doesn’t really support my argument. But absent some secret communication between he and the people on that list, it doesn’t really support his either.
#124 – Bobbolina
wtf are you talking about, dude? Have you been hitting sherry again already? It’s only Monday!
I peeked at my nuts, and there’s no swelling, no redness, no pain. I guess whoever you kicked, it was somebody else’s nuts.
# 123 brm
“Puhleze. I’m not pulling a “stunt.” I’m simply asking for some damn proof.”
Proof you know can not or should not be provided online.
The proof you asked for would in no way prove or disprove whether I spoke with any of them and you know that. So in fact it was a stunt to somehow dismiss my argument.
“which is bullshit unless I know it’s true. Simple.”
What is bullshit is that you posted that petition as some evidence that I was wrong and IT ISN’T!!! They say nothing in it that refutes my comment anywhere. I do know some of them personally and I have discussed the current economy with them so I know this first hand that petition does not say what you claim it does.
“I’m not trying to “prove” anything, ”
Bullshit you tried to prove my stance was wrong by falsely stating what the content of that petition was. Too bad for you it was short and based on a document that is no longer valid.
“I apologize if I’m bothering people with this, but I’m just trying to counter someone attacking my information with: BUT I TALKED TO THOSE GUYS AND YOU DIDN’T JUST BELIEVE IT!!”
Like I said Your request for proof is a stunt. You could simply ignore my claim and deal with the fact that YOUR claim is not what you say it is. Instead you think you can corner me on a request for proof that could be easily faked or altered as I proved with my link.
You know damn well that no one in their right mind would provide you with personal information that could be traced back to them. Therefore it is a stunt.
# 124 bobbo
“Don’t post your name here.”
I had absolutly no intention of that.
“But at least I got to kick Mustard in the nuts.”
It wasn’t kicking you were doing to his nuts!
#127 J:
*sigh*, well, I’m done with this. I already said the letter didn’t support my argument, so you win.
However,
“You know damn well that no one in their right mind would provide you with personal information that could be traced back to them. Therefore it is a stunt.”
Which is exactly the reason why I think you’re pulling a stunt by claiming to have both graduated from U.Chicago and communicated with those economists.
If you could have even say, quickly shot off a list of the professors you took classes from, or maybe the name of a thesis adviser, it would have eliminated *some* doubt as to whether or not you went there while revealing absolutely no personal information.
Instead, you acted like a 12-year old, which makes me think you really are just some kid on the basement computer.
Me? Well, I graduated from the University of Chicago too, and I personally know some of the economists who signed that letter. So there.
Mustard==so you never crossed the meridian, or you posted a false document? Good thing I get bored easily.
J–Shocking suggestion on your part. I was just paying homage to the knife fight in Butch Cassidy. I have never been near Mustards Nuts, assuming he has any. I know fer instance his seed was ground up a long time ago and turned into a condiment so he has no need for nuts. You are probably right.
brm–you enjoy the temper tantrums huh? Very patient on your part. Sounds like you drink scotch when you babysit.
#29 – Bobbolina
I don’t even know what “crossing the meridian” means. And I don’t “post document[s], false or otherwise.
So whoever’s nuts you think you kicked, they weren’t mine.
And knock off the talk about my “seed”. You’re creeping me out. I have nothing against the gay lifestyle (even though it’s not my bag of balls), but please. Don’t be hitting on me whilst posting on dvorak dot org slash blog!
Mustard==your memory of what you have/not done should be clearer than mine, so I must be wrong. Nevermind.
As to any gay reference, thats not what I think of when considering how mustard is made. Then once again, your memories regarding your own actions should be your guide.
#131 – Bobbolina
Mistabobbolina, Mistabobbobbolina, Mistabobbobbolina,
won’t you quit
you really make me sick with ya fraudulent behavior
you’re gonna make me flip and then an army couldn’t save ya
why don’t you behave ya little rugrat
take a little tip from the tabloid
because I know I’m not paranoid
when I say I saw ya tryin’ to mock me
now you and your crew are on a mission tryin’ to hawk me
but it isn’t happenin’ ya fraudulent foes
you used to front big time now I suppose
that everything’s cool since the style of apparel you adopted
you used to make fun of but now you wanna rock it
so you gotta kick it with the homies
but Mustard is already hip to your cronies
me and CM-PX thought about this and never have we seen a
brother who could look like Mista, Mista, Mistabobbolina…
[Chorus]
Ooooo, ooooo, mistabobbolina
you thought ya could manipulate
you thought you could fool me
Ooooo, ooooo, mistabobbolina
The teachers would have put me on a stump and then he schooled me
friends can be fraudulent
just you wait and see
first he was my moneygrip
then he stole my honeydip
mistabobbolina is a serpent
don’t you agree
the little two-tima
resembles Aunt Jemima
with jeans and a dirty white hoodie
seems like he wouldn’t be a snake
or would he
disguises come in all sizes and shapes
notice the facade of the snakes
they all catch the vapes
even though last year they was GQ
took a little time before the Mustard could see through
the mask
all I had to do was ask Timberlake and Kwame
and my man responded they would bomb a
fraudulent foe with the strength of Hercules
the way ya on my dick must really hurt ya knees
you need to take heed and quit being such a groupie
ever since I did a little show in Guadeloupee
I neva saw a groupie like you
but what is funny is ya wanted to be down with my crew
but Mustard is not down with any clowns or jesters
so I would suggest
that ya try to impress Uncle Fester
bobbolina
because ya don’t impress me
bobbolina
the style of dress is not the key
bobbolina
it’s all in the mind and the heart
so you should start
by remembering ya gotta pay a fee
bobbolina
[Chorus]
ooooo ooooo mistabobbolina,
ooooo ooooo mistabobbolina,
ooooo ooooo mistabobbolina,
[chorus]
“Which is exactly the reason why I think you’re pulling a stunt by claiming to have both graduated from U.Chicago and communicated with those economists.”
Yeah that’s right a stunt I setup two year running on this blog just for this occasion.
“If you could have even say, quickly shot off a list of the professors you took classes from, or maybe the name of a thesis adviser, it would have eliminated *some* doubt as to whether or not you went there while revealing absolutely no personal information.”
Oh bullshit that isn’t what you asked for. HERE IS WHAT YOU ASKED FOR.
“Pics or it didn’t happen. Graduation pic? A scan of your diploma? At this point I’d consider a Facebook or Linkdin profile as some kind of proof that you went to U.Chicago.”
None of which I would ever post online unaltered.
So you weren’t looking for a list of professors. You were pulling a stunt and hoping I would back off because you though I was lying. Too bad for you. I wasn’t and I won’t. I am from Chicago and you claim you went to school here which means you should know that about a Chicagoan. But of course you don’t because you didn’t
How would a list of professors prove anything? I could look that up on the intertubes. IT IS PROOF OF NOTHING!!
“Me? Well, I graduated from the University of Chicago too, and I personally know some of the economists who signed that letter. So there.”
Really?
Prove it!
# 129 bobbo
“J–Shocking suggestion on your part. ”
I was kidding.
#131 – Bobbolina
>>As to any gay reference, thats not what I >>think of when considering how mustard is made.
If you’re not aware of the use of the term “seed” as a euphemis for semen, then I suggest you get back to your Bible study. If you start at the very beginning (a very good place to start), you will read in Genesis 38:9
“And Onan knew that the seed should not be his; and it came to pass, when he went in unto his brother’s wife, that he spilled [it] on the ground, lest that he should give seed to his brother.”
# 134 Mister Mustard
What the hell was that is post #132?
LOL
HITLER. Yeah, I said it. Now shut the fuck up you UOC furcktard ball-gargling noobs. Way to turn an interesting thread into ass-milk.
#135 – J
>>What the hell was that is post #132?
It’s the lyrics to Del The Funky Homosapien’s classic song “Mistadobolina”. He put out a re-mix paying homage to Bobbo.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UlAqjUu_TA (original version)
[Duplicate comment deleted. Please don’t double post! – ed.]
#136, #138 – Bobby
>>Now shut the fuck up you UOC furcktard
>>Now shut the fuck up you UOC fucktard
>>ball-gargling doughnut-punchers.
What does “UOC” mean, son? Ultimate Operational Capability? Universitat Oberta de Catalunya?
Univesity of Chicago. Although, it isn’t commonly used. Most of use write it all out.
Ubersexual osx cyberliterati
Basically, Eurotrash Macintosh using turtleneck wearing coffee house intellectuals.
Um, If all the dems in the House voted for this it would have carried.
They didn’t because the people that sent them to Washington made it clear they’d send them home.
If the Speaker of the House had kept her big mouth shut it might have still carried but she talked a lot of Reps into voting no.
She also gave some of her good buddies who are Dems a free pass on voting no while leaning on a bunch of young senators to vote yes.
This is going to be much harder to do the next time around.
I’d say give it a week or two and maybe something not as bad will show up.
I’m starting to wonder if the best thing for the gov. to do is nothing. Let it work itself out.
I think we may just find out. The people that voted Rep. do not approve of the bail out and many Rep. can’t vote for it if they want a job.
The retirees voted yes while the newcomers voted no.
The comments on this blog are too funny. It shows how little people really understand what is going on and how politicians can say essentially anything to their supporters and they blindly believe it, because it’s what they want to hear and believe.
Here are a few tips on reality –
1. Government spending has nothing to do with the current problem. It was a problem in making loans to people that are not paying.
2. In an attempt to increase the profit on owning home mortgages, many banks loaned their own and borrowed money in these non-performing loans. The banks essentially put 5% of their money, and 95% borrowed money into these enhanced yield products.
3. The accounting rules changed requiring writting down the non-paying loans immediately. In the past, you could write these down over time, but not today.
The net result of this was – If Merrill Lynch had $1,000,000 to invest in these loans, they would borrow $19,000,000 and loan out in total $20,000,000. They were paying 4% on the deposits and loaning it out at 6%. So on their $1,000,000 investment, they were earning 30%. Do the math, you will eventually get there. It was great while it lasted.
Then, some of the loans quit paying their monthly bills. The accounting rules said, write em off. So, Merrill’s $20,000,000 in loans was suddenly worth only $4,000,000 (they write them down to 20% of the original value). So Merrill lost not only their original investment of $1,000,000, but also an additional $15,000,000.
Repeat this over and over in almost every bank, hedge fund, pension fund and insurance company in the world, and you begin to get the picture. The world banking system is broken. Most of the banks are broke. The ones who didn’t drink the kool-aid (Bank America) or were smart enough to smell trouble and get out (JP Morgan) will survive. The others have already gone under or are in the process of going out of business.
That pension you expected to start getting, may be gone (at least a big piece of it).
Your retirement mutual funds, gone (as banks continue to sell off assets to get the funds to stay solvent, the stock market continues to drop).
Your retiree medical benefits, gone (companies are not required by law to provide this and they will start doing anything to remain solvent and cut expenses, especially to those who no longer work there).
Essentially what the treasury is trying to do is to establish a process to value these loans and buy the loans at a realistic rate, so the remaining good banks will survive. The accounting requirements on the writeoffs are so stringent, that they are required to write these off, probably below what the eventual value will be.
The sad thing is, the thousands of people who work at these financial institutions, had their retirement stolen away in a few days. The fat cats spread their money around so thye will be OK. It’s the worker bees who are screwed, and probably don’t know it yet.
#146, Brock,
Very good summary. One thing you didn’t mention is that $19,000,000 the institution borrowed is borrowed several times again by other institutions. When some of it disappears from the market then it reverberates until that loss is absorbed, somewhere, somehow.