You WILL respect my authoritay!
This isn’t about how investigators were able to smuggle liquid explosives and detonators past TSA screeners earlier this year. It’s about the atrocious treatment endured by some Fort Lewis soldiers who were escorting the remains of a colleague home to Virginia earlier this month. Brief background: On the tarmac, an honor guard had been formed by Port of Seattle Police, airport fire and rescue and military personnel as the soldier’s body was placed on the plane. A police officer then took the escort soldiers up to security. The TSA screener checked everyone’s ID, including the police officer, and then had the soldiers go through the metal detectors. Their combat ribbons and medals set off the alarms.
So what does the TSA screener do? He has the soldiers strip off their uniforms – in front of everyone – down to their tee shirts, pants and socks. Will someone please tell me what the hell is wrong with these people? How does some inept, insensitive idiot with the IQ of room temperature even get a TSA job? That TSA screener should have his ass fired.
I am not typically a violent person. But if I were those soldiers, I think I would have opened up a case of whoop-ass.
Josh, what the fuck are you talking about? Methinks perhaps you have had TOO MUCH of the Ambien, Percocet, etc.
Are you really objecting to my contention that if the rank-and-filers among us are supposed to go through metal detectors and security checkpoints, that everyone should be required to do that, even real and pretend firemen, ambulance drivers, gusy with millitary uniforms from the local surplus store, etc.?
I had a chance to visit my folks in the US and told them about my experience with the TSA and the response was “Well we are at war…”
My mind instantly flashed back to that Spielberg classic film “1941” with John Belushi and Dan Ackroyd and here we are 2007 living the movie! LOL! Instead of the “Japs are coming” hysteria we now have “Terrorist” hysteria!
With WHOM is the US at “war” with?
Terrorists?
If so then isn’t US at “war” with:
Drug lords?
The mafia?
Drunk drivers?
etc
It seems that India is a country who is really at “war” with terrorists. When I was there recently they had two terrorist bombs attacks in other cities – so the threat of terrorist attacks is supported with actual attacks. One would think flying in India was be a security nightmare…it wasn’t.
So be careful the Japs…er…the terrorists are coming!
Cheers
#31…Mustard….no…that’s not what I’m suggesting or what took place in this incident.
The 2 soldier’s escorting the dead soldier’s casket back to his home in Virginia didn’t buy their uniforms in the surplus store.
The port police (who are the police for Sea-Tac airport) and firemen formed an honor guard out of courtesy towards a dead serviceman, with the soldiers that were escorting him. After the casket was loaded the Sea-Tac police OFFICER then escorted the 2 servicemen up for boarding. When they arrived at the metal detector the Sea-Tac OFFICER showed his ID as did the active duty servicemen. When the metal detector went off, these men were told they had to strip for a search. Now, in my book, and apparently the airport’s book and the local Congressman’s book, this was uncalled for. These men were being vouched for by an Officer of the Sea-Tac police force, as well as their orders. Their ID’s made it plain who they were. But said TSA employee wasn’t satisfied.
This is where a small dab of common sense would have been a good thing.
No one was asking the TSA people to allow, willy nilly anyone in a uniform to pass through ……these guy’s were legit, they showed ID….they were vouched for by the airport’s own security (which is a legitimate police force), in fact an officer of the police force is who accompanied them.
Sometimes Mustard, your vile rants are justified….. but this time your just an asshole.
>>Sometime’s Mustard, your vile rant’s are
>>justified…..but this time your just an
>>asshole.
That’s your belief, Josh, and you’re entitled to it.
Me, I wouldn’t care if I were the Dalai Lama, the Shah of Iran, or the President of the United States; if I were trying to get through airport security to a civilian commercial airport gate, I would expect to remove all metal objects and put them in the plastic tray.
And nobody has successfully explained yet why a military corpse, deserving of an honor guard, was being flown from a military base in Washington state to Virginia via a commercial airline.
yet another case of nepolean-ism – you cant give power to little people, they have no idea how to use it.
and by little, i mean low IQ
The soldiers had guns. It’s a well known fact that if you shoot a civil servant in the leg he has to be fired as Bush will not pay for the operation that allows them to keep their feet in their mouthes (every civil servant must have at least two mouths so that the can talk out of both sides of their head
#34 Mr Mustard,
AHA!
You work for the TSA! You bugger!! LOL!!!!
Cheers
>they pull out the MAC-10s, the AK-47s, the C-4 explosive, and the suitcase nuke, and turn the airport into a smoking heap of radioactive waste,
You don’t need to go through metal detectors to do that. And the suitcase nuke is a fairy tale story.
>>You don’t need to go through metal detectors to
>>do that. And the suitcase nuke is a fairy tale
>>story.
So what’s the real problem here, Mikie? Are you really so offended that people who show up at a civilian airport claiming to be military/ police/ ambulance drivers should be expected to go through a metal detector?
If they had turned out to be terrorists or other rascals up to no good, you can be assured that TSA critics would have torn the roof off in their comments about how the retards responsible for our national security couldn’t keep out a gaggle of phony soldiers, giving them a free pass into the heart of the airport with whatever sorts of metal-detector-detectable weaponry they had.
And no one has yet satisfactorily explained why a group of people “on the tarmac” (who had presumably ALREADY gotten through the security checkpoint) were brought back to the security checkpoint to disrobe. That makes me think there’s something to this story that’s not being revealed.
Nothing about this story makes sense!
I work for the TSA, Were the soldiers TOLD to remove their jackets and such or did they ELECT to. Any person can elect not to remove the offending metel and get wanded ! it is their choice. The article also says “a TSA employee” there is no such thing, in this case there would have been multiple TSA employees along with a supervisior who would make sure the process was handled properly.
I would like to hear directly from the the soldiers / Police Officers involved. or at least a witness or the person who started the story.
I think the story is for the most part a fabrication
it’s about harassing and humiliating all of us, it’s not about finding terrorists…the current admin is trying to break us of our pesky need to be “American” and independent and FREE.
Come on, folks, can’t we all see what all this stuff does? It wears us out. Who has any fight left in them, anyway…..and if you do, you’ll get it pulled from your soul.
I refuse to fly as long as I have to take off my stupid SHOES and get that extra special attention (they still cant’ do a decent back rub)
#40, MeMine,
I have to agree with you. I think this story is bull.
If they were stopped, it would have been by a TSA agent, not an employee.
If they just came from loading a casket onto a plane, they would have entered through the airline doors to the boarding area. They would not have left the screened area.
If they set off the metal detector, they should have been wanded before stripping.
There was no reaction, quote, or response from the airport, police, military, or TSA.
The big give away this is bull ??? No one’s name is listed. Nor is there any indication of when it happened. Because the local Congressman is “working to see it never happens again”, it would have been reasonable to expect it happened several days ago minimum.
And the real biggest give away ??? It seems all postings all were written or quote verbatim this Ken Shram guy. If this actually happened then it is only reasonable to expect some else to have reported on it.
And, excepting for Mustard putting up a good fight, all you suckers were taken in. All someone has to do is post an attention getting headline and all you idiots fall into the trap. THINK first. QUESTION the story. ANALYSE the response. Then post your comments.
The idea that the sheep are still in the game against the wolves is fatuous. The game was over back in November of ’63
The only thing left that will truly help
“civilization” is a giant asteroid impact.
Why should military personnel be treated differently than anyone else?
Because sometimes the government says so. My brother is a Marine reservist. He usually ends up flying commercially when traveling to his annual deployment. Each time he has been given written orders (he has to travel in uniform by the way) to carry with him stating that his baggage is not to be searched, and each time some knucklehead security agent has picked him out given him the “open your bags or you can’t pass” ultimatum.
#5
>> Go live in China or North Korea if you want to talk about a real police state.
I live in Shanghai, China…not much of a police state that I can see – what do you expect from a knock off anyway. 😉
Cheers
>>stating that his baggage is not to be searched
Why not? What’s he got in there? Classified materials? State secrets? C-4 explosive?
#42….Fusion…..You make a good point. When I tried the other day to get a fuller version of this story, all I could find were *patriotic* sites all referring back to Schrams site and story.
I decided to wait a few days to see if something may get posted, as of today….nada.
I apologize to Mustard. But, I still disagree with Mustard’s contention that certain people shouldn’t be waved through. Congressmen, Senator’s and other public officials of all types are routinely waved through. A soldier with proper orders and ID should be, as far as I’m concerned, he’s far more valuable to society than members of the legislature.
“Congressmen, Senator’s and other public officials of all types are routinely waved through.”
Can you provide a link for this? I work for TSA and I know of no exemptions for these people. In fact, I remember a congressman or 2 getting annoyed that they have to be screened as well. I won’t say it hasn’t been done, but it definately isn’t policy.
>>A soldier with proper orders and ID should be,
>>as far as I’m concerned, he’s far more
>>valuable to society than members of the
>>legislature.
First of all, these were not “soldiers with proper orders”. They were (or claimed to be) ambulance drivers, miscellaneous “safety” personnel, airport firement, police, and guys who belonged (or once belonged, or claim to have once belonged) to the military, who were there as part of the honor guard. There’s no reason to think they h ad “proper orders” to do anything, as what they were doing was organized by the SeaTac police, not the DoD.
Second, while soldiers may be far more valuable to society than congressmen and senators, so are school teachers, nurses, philanthropists, scientists, people who volunteer for charity work, and a million other categories.
The idea here is not to badger heroic soldiers on their way to fight for truth, justice, and the American way; it’s to ferret out suicide bombers pretending to be soldiers, disgruntled soldiers who have turned into suicide bombers, and anyone else who may have malfeasance up their sleeve.
Mister Mustard,
I have worked at an airport for many years, (long before 9/11) and have some information that may help clarify some of the details of this story.
First,when any soldier is killed in combat he is returned to his base to be honored before he is returned to his home. The body is then escorted by 1 or 2 soldiers often on commercial carriers. They accompany the body at all times with the exception of the belly of the aircraft. They most likely contacted the Seatac Airport Police for escort on the tarmac which is how the police and fireman became involved in the honor guard. The casket and soldiers would have been screened by the police prior to ramp access. At the aircraft they watch as the casket is loaded(always head first.) In the old days they would have then be escorted to their seat on the aircraft. Now days everyone going on the aircraft must go through the security checkpoint so the airport police escorted them to the TSA.
I agree that no one should be exempt from screening, but human respect doesn’t have to be disregarded. I have witnessed TSA demanding a severely disabled person walk thru the metal detector instead of being hand wanded in her wheelchair. I have also witnessed TSA going out of thier way to assist and accomodate passenger needs without compomising security. As none of us were there this may in fact be a small story blown way out of proportion. I just believe that even though we all have to go through the TSA to access the airplane, doesn’t allow them to disregard human dignity in the process.
I hope some of these details of how this works clarifies what the story didn’t say. You seemed to be getting confused about who was screened and why.
And PS…I’ve worked in the airline industy for 30 years, and for what it’s worth, the TSA isn’t here for our security, it is for the illusion of security. But that’s an argument for a different day.
>>The casket and soldiers would have been
>>screened by the police prior to ramp access.
Then what’s the problem here? Why is that rabid commentator claiming that after having arrived at the plane (and already having been screened) they were required to go BACK TO SECURITY to be screened again?
>>You seemed to be getting confused about who
>>was screened and why.
Not reallly. The article claimed that people from the “outside world” were screened, and it’s self-evident why they were screened.
What I’m confused about is what’s the bfd here? Why is that commentator flecking us all with spittle in his enraged diatribe about people being screened? And why is he claiming that people who were ALREADY screened were forced to re-do the screening, and to disrobe to boot? Since they were “on the tarmac” they had, by definition, already been screened.
Correct! They were probably had wanded at the securtiy gates to access the ramp. However, to be boarded as a passenger they still have to go through the same security checkpoint you do. (Another TSA rule.)
The bfd is that some of us believe that these men should in fact be honored for what they do and have given for our country. In many cases the men accompanying the body are in fact soldiers from the same unit and served with the deceased.
It should have been handled differently. Any passenger can request a private screening. As we weren’t there, we can’t know why the airport police didn’t request/suggest one from the beginning. Barring that, as soon as there was an issue the TSA should have suggested they step to the side and finish with a private hand wanding. Most military I have encountered would not have known to request this option.
Look I didn’t read all of the comments. But obviously you know nothing about being in the military and traveling on commercial flights. Before I begin don’t bother criticizing me, because I know how this works being in the military myself. Get a couple of quarters and call someone who actually cares. I’m going to tell you right now if you’re traveling on orders in the military 95% of the time it’s on a commercial flight. Why because it’s cheaper for the government to buy you a 200 dollar ticket than divert a whole fucking cargo plane just for you to go somewhere. Obviously if you’re going to Iraq you’ll be on a military flight. But if you’re just going to a conus base or home or wherever its going to be a com flight. Second, I’m pretty sure that there is some regulation somewhere that states under no circumstance are you allowed to remove you’re uniform in public. Its kinda like dropping the flag on the ground. That’s why TSA stipulates military do not have to remove their shoes unless detector goes off. Shoes! Not the uniform. Now lastly. You would really have to know your stuff to pull off a up to regs uniform by going to a surplus store. TSA should be smart enough to know how you’re suppose to look. And its a little impossible to pull off a fake military ID. It has a visible imbedded chip and can be swiped like a credit card which are security measures to ensure you are military. Now let me ask when the military patrols an airport for security reasons do you think they should have to go through security because they could be terrorists? That their loaded M4’s should go through the xray? Seriously people grow up and get a life. Its people like you that make me question why I’m defending you. It breaks my heart everyday I turn on the news and see how the civilian world is doing. All these companies failing and the economy going down. And its no ones fault but the people who live in America.
Secret,
Couldn’t have ranted better dude. I’ve given 20 years and my health for this country, and everytime I see idiots like these post this kind of BS I wonder if we shouldn’t just let the Hadji’s do some real damage to this country. It’s a been a couple of hundred years since people in this country have known what it’s like to deal with real threats and oppression. Everyone is easy to criticize, but are also the first to cry for help from the military or emergency services when they’re int trouble. People take too much for granted – maybe it’s worth it to find out just exactly how people in countries that don’t have the protections and freedoms we have live.
The military personel are not required to take off anything for security because while they are escorting a fallen service member they are on duty. To take off anything while on duty is disgracing the uniformed services. All they needed to do was say “no” and ask to be wanded in a private room so they can keep military bearing. It’s not as easy as you think for a terrorist to impersonate a soldier, airman, marine or sailor if you’ve spent time around the military you’d know the difference.
Ok, first off many of you people disgust me. From what I read so far, you have disrespected a soldier who DIED in war. And secondly, apparently many of you are not familiar with the military and air travel, so sit down knuckle draggers and let me educate you. First off yes we have planes that can transport soldiers but their use is not to transport fallen soldiers who are on INACTIVE duty, mmmkay. So we use the civilian planes. Secondly, if you read the entire story, which most of you obviously didn’t, and if you did you may have missed it, but the soldiers had showed their ID cards, which are valide federal cards with security clearance that NO terrorist can copy without the right sort of military equipment, there is a little chip on the card which has all the credentials of that particular soldier, so when TSA scans a military ID card, it tells the TSA agent that this is a Federal Employee and should be let by. Another thing, do any of you realize how many metallic objects are on the Class A uniform of a soldier? Didn’t think so, but removing every individual piece is very time consuming, also we are trained that by removing the required uniform in public is strictly prohibited and degrading to the whole of the military, so it is degrading to strip down to the T Shirt. Oh and yes there are planes that fly from Kuwait to Fort Lewis and vice versa, so yeah.
To Rasco and so what..I don’t think I’ve read 2 more ignorant statements in a long time..if you have an education go get your money back as you were robbed. As someone who’s escorted a fallen friend to his final resting place believe me when I say we’re screened ahead of time and the airlines know of our arrival and are give full details regarding this duty…as for the absolutely idiotic, pathetic, mentally challenged statement that some awards are probably for attendance I can only say that you have the mentality of a plastic soap dish and the IQ of a house plant.
You bitches that wanna seem to do your part to fight terrorism by offering airport security advice should enlist in the military and go face the enemy on a daily basis. Fucking spineless cowards. What a disgrace to this nation. And disrespect to the military that keeps YOU safe.