There is some truth to Trump’s story that Obama wiretapped him in that Obama wiretapped everyone, as Edward Snowden revealed. He also wiretapped Hillary, and you and me. He wiretapped our friends and he wiretapped our enemies. So even though Trump is making this story up, it happens to also be true.
Although now that Trump is president Trump is wiretapping himself. Maybe Trump should put a stop to illegal warrantless wiretapping? That would be a big step to making America great again.
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As Obama’s speechwriter said, it looks like the Obama spokesmen are being very careful in their denials, only denying that Obama ordered wiretapping, but not(except for James Clapper) denying that surveillance happened.
Yes – and we know how truthful Clapper is.
Do you have anything other than the time he was in open session asked about classified programs?
He did admit he lied. Don’t you believe him?
He had to lie because to tell the truth would be revealing classified info.
You got anything else?
But sure maybe his denial shouldn’t be believed. It is pretty forceful though, that he would definitely have known about it.
If you expand “wiretap” to total data vacuum suck-up, then I agree.
BUT that would be a total TRUMPIAN redefinition of the word/concept.
Do you/Snowden actually mean wiretap (ie: words spoken actually recorded) or do you mean date time and parties involved?
It bothers me that in the age of the NSA/Snowden we could very well be living in 1984 today.
According to an article I read … what is alleged works like this …
1) There was an attempt to wiretap Trump. A judge saw it was Trump and denied the wiretap.
2) The second attempt was broader, a judge saw it was Trump and denied the wiretap.
3) Third attempt to get a wiretap was setup as an effort to spy on a foreign target, and Trump’s phone number was one of the ones in the list. It was accepted.
The real problem to me is that the way spying works these days, how do you know the NSA isn’t listening to your phone calls or my phone calls?
I can say “I don’t really care” because “I’m never talking to someone about anything interesting anyway”, but at the same time the right to privacy is disappearing and protections against illegal search and seizure is annoying.
Part of me wonders how much crime they stop/catch/prevent. Maybe it is “worth it”.
But even if it is “worth it” what is to stop it from becoming corporate espionage stealing trade secrets and such or worse listening in to political activity.
True enuf. I think its a “given” that T.Rump was tapped. The question is by whom and why for. I doubt Obama “personally” asked for it….why should he have? T.Rump was/is a joke and was supposed to lose. Not worth the political capital, even for a lame duck who probably seethes that T.Rump got any traction at all with his Birtherism BS.
I assume for atleast 10 years now if not 15 that all our phone calls are at least “accessible” to the Feds. The problem for awhile being storage space? Weren’t various programs, “Python” comes to mind, reported as scooping up everything. Had their own duplicate server in AT&T’s switching room and so forth?
I would further think T.Rump would have spy proofed his communications against business competitors/the mob for years before: just good business.
The whole issue all around is BS. Waste of Time. FRAUD on us citizens. NAME THE WORST THING THE RUSSKIES DID.
Worst I’ve heard: posted truthful emails from the DNC. As posted here already…. who should be shamed is the Main Stream Media for not having developed sources. The Russians did us a favor by hacking the DNC….. didn’t tell us anything we didn’t already know.
Its all BS. Stinking rotting BS………… as the country slides into third world.
………….. good thing the beer is cold.
“as the country slides into third world.”
I’ve argued several times that no matter who got elected, it was just a matter of time and no one can stop it.
We are humans after all.
Feudalism is the natural order of things. Whether or not we like it or hate it, the class system exists for a reason.
Trump isn’t someone from higher up in the class system but rather “noveau riche” that is looked down up by the elites, he was some slightly above-average guy that is just now discovering the machinery in place to keep him in his place.
Of course they developed the sources, they were in on it! The Russians revealed that too. However, no one in the media was willing to risk the attacks from their own side to declare that Hillary is a bad candidate who belongs in jail. Would have been enough time to get in Joe Biden or Liz Warren. Instead they attacked Matt Lauer for asking questions.
Let’s see,
Obama wiretapped Trump – Illegal
Info then leaked to the press – Illegal
Democrat does this – Now Legal
Another flip-flop, long time coming:
http://i2.wp.com/www.powerlineblog.com/ed-assets/2017/03/S36ldLP-1.jpg
I have to admire the Trump loyalists, standing by their man no matter how many times he falls on his face and steps on his own dick. You guys rock! 😀
Uh … check this out …
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C2mKZ4xXAAEZItp.jpg
“Trump aides wiretapped” — New York Times, Jan 17 2017
So as time rolls on the details are going to come out. Even Chuck Shumer doesn’t deny that that Trump people were wiretapped.
And by the way, they caught the guy in St. Louis who vandalized a Jewish Cemetary, it is an African American guy who hates Trump.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4278908/Man-arrested-bomb-threats-against-Jewish-centers.html
Phydeau score today is -2
The New York cemetery was caused by the environment, according to CNN reporting. So Phydeau and liberals have declared that Mother Nature is a Trump supporter!
How thoughtful of you, Hmeyers, to provide me with a scorecard! I’m not quite sure what I’m being scored on, though.
Are you saying, in your dim way, that because some of the threats against JCCs were tracked down to a possibly mentally ill black guy, that I was somehow “wrong” in reporting an increase in such events?
And because some Trump aides have been wiretapped, the comments I’ve made about Trump accusing Obama of personally wiretapping him are somehow “wrong”?
Perhaps you could research “straw man” arguments (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man) and try to refrain from them in the future. 🙂
Also my point about demonstrating how you are provably wrong twice in the above isn’t personal. I enjoy discussing things with you and every once in a while you post some great info/links.
I’m just demonstrating that when you have bias, you believe anything you want to hear.
You backed wrong horses twice because they whispered what you wanted to believe.
You need to use critical thinking and be skeptical of what you read.
Critically thinking Phydeau isn’t going to happen. He’s an acolyte, not an independent.
Did that feel good, Ah_Yea? I bet that felt good, didn’t it. Glad to bring a smile to your day! 😉
SCORE!
Hmeyers, almost everything I post here has links to back up what I’m saying, unlike folks like Ah_yea who just say “you’re wrong I know it” and offer no evidence.
You are one of the strangest Trump supporters here, struggling to appear “impartial”. God bless you. Hang in there.
It’s hard for Bernie supporters to stay on the Trump train. Seeing loons like you on the side of the tracks keeps them hanging on.
Trump actually held himself back:
https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2017/march/trump-clinton-debates-gender-reversal.html
Inside Trump’s fury: The president rages at leaks, setbacks and accusations
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/inside-trumps-fury-the-president-rages-at-leaks-setbacks-and-accusations/2017/03/05/40713af4-01df-11e7-ad5b-d22680e18d10_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_trumptumult-830pm:homepage/story&utm_term=.1554bdd2fe0b
What did you think would happen, hiring someone with no qualifications for the job?
We already hired Obama. What happened was Trump.
Trump opponents don’t just rage, they beat up supporters and put lady professors in the hospital, just because they don’t like what someone has to say.
You need to relax. Liberals right now are talking about how great it would be to have as President Reagan or Bush. Maher says he would give the million dollars he donated to keep Romney from becoming President, to Romney AND he would become a Mormon to have Romney take over the country.
Decade or two, liberals will be saying that Trump is great.
No one – not even Republicans will say Trump is great.
You may be right,
Republicans may not say Trump is great,
The say Trump is Better! (than the alternative)
You probably would have said that about Bush 10 years ago. Now SNL is cheering when people quote Bush speeches.
I love score cards. It “objectifies” the dispute.
HMyers: your two points were perfectly dispatched by Phydeau–or what am I missing. The first point re wiretapps is totally plain to see: The Justice Department and/or FBI wiretapping close associates of T.Rump because of their Russian activities is totally proper..even if Obama suggested it in any manner. There are federal laws against such direct involvement…evidence should be “overwhelming” in nature, not mere supposition or baseless allegation.
I don’t immediately get the crazy black man desecrating tombstones as an attack on T.Rump….. but that is the nature of crazy. Do I even want to understand how Oh_NO comes to his conclusions?
Doesn’t it look right now like anyone would be a better President than T.Rump? So, that would include Regan and Bush, and Jackson and Harrison, and the Crazy Black Guy, and Oh_NO. Pretty tight group.
Everyone else is better than the worst. Words are like that.
Phydeau was saying Trump supporters were vandalizing Jewish cemetaries — I was like “Hmmmm, shoe doesn’t fit. Where are Trump supporters in St. Louis and Philly?”.
It didn’t add up.
But yeah, we should scorecard each other to make things more fun.
Like Bobbo -1 for self-driving cars, hahaha! 🙂
The main flaw in that system, I generally predict things — I just mostly listen.
But Phydeau deserves credit for making assertions. Most people aren’t brave enough to make assertions.
I will make this assertion — SpaceX says it will put 2 people in Moon orbit in 2018 — I’m prepared to say that even by 2020 it won’t happen.
Let’s do some predictions for scorecarding. I’ll do a separate post.
Yeah….aren’t his low earth orbit rockets still blowing up fairly often?
In my own mind………I would not take the first few flights if any at all. Too risky for the payoff. What I would like to do is take a balloon to 80K feet…past the boundary into space where you see black space and look down on the curvature of the Earth. Safe, cheap…. I would do that trip.
I can see the private moon trip “never” happening. Millionsaires want to live to spend their money. Poor dopes like myself would go for the thrill if the ticket was bought for them. Coupons?
I’m with you on no for 2018, unless by people in orbit, you mean it ends up with Marc Perkel in orbit and the spaceship gone.
So some of the vandalism has been attributed to one person. The rest of it as far as I know has not been solved. Tighten up your logic there, Hmeyers.
So a Trump hater who works as a reporter and wrote an article complaining about how ridiculous it was for Trump to call it a false flag operation was behind some incidents, Nature another. Your list of things that might have been done by Trump is shrinking.
Unless you are claiming Trump is responsible for the incidents when Obama was President.
“I heard” those new Samsung VR-ready phones are capable of perceiving and receiving users’ thoughtcrimes — a la the 1983 Natalie Wood movie “Brainstorm”. Can anyone disprove this?
(Ref: Brainstorm (1983 film) – Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brainstorm_(1983_film)
Also, is it not also true that the infrared receiver of any of our TV sets or cable TV boxes is capable of IR imaging of who’s in your living room? Can it record our conversations, too?
Damn, this Big Brother stuff is getting as big as King Kong!
Kill your television.
(Geeez, I thought I was kidding! 😉
Wikileaks: The CIA is using popular TVs, smartphones and cars to spy on their owners – The Washington Post
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-switch/wp/2017/03/07/why-the-cia-is-using-your-tvs-smartphones-and-cars-for-spying/
Ya miss the point, back in the early years of this nation, there was much of the same. You can’t let the leaders lead… we need to lead the leaders, we, all of us, come on…. put down the struggles and let’s just do this thing just like Pres Trump sez…it’s all about us!
How could ever feel otherwise?
oh, and Dick Morris has been been somewhat absent from his podcast jsyuk, recently, hmm/
Here ya go
http://www.dickmorris.com/category/lunchtime-videos/
I just figured out the initial Trump – Russia lie.
It was to provide justification for the wiretapping, so corrupt Obama and cronies could sabotage Trump’s presidency.
Fools, they still don’t know why or how they lost.
The Cheeto in charge is using a cell very similar to mine. You gotta be kidding yourself if you believe his cell can’t be listened in on by, you name it. Even on a hard line with his cell nearby most of the conversation can be listened in on.
The Conversation (1974)
With Gene Hack-man, sometimes the universe just expands the funniest way.
LOL.
White House Lifts Several Sentences From Exxon Mobil Press Release
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/white-house-exxon-mobil-press-release_us_58bdd143e4b0d8c45f45ad5c
Need any more proof that the White House is in the pockets of the big corporations?
How’s that swampy-drainy thingy working out for ya, wingnuts? 🙄
Federal workforce has shrunk by 6,000. Regulations are less now.
What or who were let go? Please do not point to a wing nut Web article.
http://www.marketplace.org/2017/02/10/economy/federal-workers-stay-mum-trump-and-turn-unions
I think there are about 6000 unfilled T.Rump cabinet and gubment support staff positions because Bannon cannot find enough crazy people to fill them.
……….and then Blame Obama.
Actually pretty close, way to go Bobbo!
They haven’t let anyone go.
They have instituted a hiring freeze.
I estimate 2 million federal workers, about 50k retiring every year, so one thousand leaving every week.
Trump tweets out another lie
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2017/03/07/youll-never-guess-who-tweeted-something-false-that-he-saw-on-tv/
That’s just Trump! Tweeting out lies one after the other. But it works… who’s talking about Jeff Sessions perjuring himself lying about his contacts with the Russians?
It remains to be seen whether the media will just follow Trump along willy-nilly trying to cover his latest offhand lie, and ignore the real issues.
The chart in the article ‘debunking’ Trump shows what we all know to be true, that Democrats were holding up Cabinet picks.
https://img.washingtonpost.com/wp-apps/imrs.php?src=https://img.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp-content/uploads/sites/11/2017/03/Confirmed.jpg&w=1484
Chart shows TRump now tied with Obama?
…………and doesn’t show…… “why.”
Which line is clearly at the bottom?
From reading the “comments” here, all but a few are Ditto Heads.
Yes, all the lines of communication are intercepted. This is so 2013.
Even James Comey warned the public to cover the cameras and mics on your laptops and I suggest you go even further, blackout the cameras on your cell phones, front and back. You can buy blackout dots of differing sizes on amazon.
Show me PROOF President Obama specifically went to a FISA court to get a warrant to TAPPED dipsticks phone. I don’t mean a loony right wingnut web site. If, a FISA warrant was issued I am sure the said warrant was not specific to dipstick but aimed at shady campaign sources with ties to foreign governments.
Wake up Ditto Heads, your government may be compromised.
Why oh why is the dipstick Not using the cell phone of choice for Presidents. The Boeing Black is a secure self destructing device made just for people in power. Google if not familiar.
Doesn’t much matter,
Absolutely guarantee that the Boeing Black is hacked already by the CIA.
For those who are willing, we are beginning to see through the cracks and finding who actually runs our government.
https://wikileaks.org/ciav7p1/
Who is wikileaks now working for, not the American public.
Here is just one snip-it of your opinion on wikileaks.
Ah_Yea says:
7/26/2010 at 8:30 am
Ok, I just figured this out.
Is it any coincidence that these leaks were published to coincide nicely with McChrystal’s resignation and Petraeus’s new war strategy?
Let’s face it. Our military guys are not stupid. Probably a whole lot smarter than most in the Government.
We have always wondered why McChrystal would let a Rolling Stone reporter so close to his people, and let his people say what they did.
So McChrystal is out (with 4 stars) and Petraeus is in. Petraeus wants to do things differently.
Now this comes out, showing business as usual won’t work.
Coincidence? Yea, right.
See, a real politician would never accidentally tell the truth.
You polifail us D.trump.
To those who don’t already know that the alphabet organizations have been in power for many decades, sorry, but now you know. The threat by JFK to shred the CIA may have gotten him assassinated. If you work with, instead of against, all is hunky dory.
I bet you won’t hear a peep outta Cheeto about the alphabets, he is too chicken, so, blame President Obama. What a chicken, bad feet gets him outta Nam now blames leaks and wire tapping on President Obama. https://goo.gl/images/I59uqY
So you’re saying Lee Harvey Oswald didn’t act alone? That there was a conspiracy by a shadow government to to take down the President of the Untied States of America?
Do tell….
Do you believe the Warren report? I for one Do Not.
Hey Jp: anything “specific” in the Warren Report strike you as implausible?
I find it implausible that a conspiracy of the type needed by the JFK Alt Reality crowd could remain secret for this long. Just ain’t hooman nature.
The bullet path: last time I read up on it did read weird…but then “could happen”…and since it did?
The killing of Oswald and loss of evidence: easily the work of competent people doing something unusual for the first time….and too many people trying to take control. SNAFU all the way……. hate it when that happens/no do-overs.
Sad times to have witnessed.
Liberals at the time as now preferred the narrative that JFK was killed by right wingers in Dallas the biggest city that voted for Nixon.
When the reality was he was shot by a Communist, that was too hard for them to reconcile with the story they told themselves, even though JFK was a fierce anti-Communist whose personally delivered money to Nixon saying his dad would support Nixon if JFK didn’t win the nomination.
Ex CIA Agent E Howard Hunt admitted to CIA and LBJ involvement in JFK assassination on his deathbed.
https://tinyurl.com/j6zolb4
According to his estranged son who appears to have hated his dad for working for the CIA. He had his own story he wanted to believe. Like with the National Guard fake memos, we have here some copies of documents, in a magazine that published a fake rape story.
This death bed revalation smacks of the Vietnam War confessional espoused by Robert Macnamara.
If anyone says they would prefer George W. Bush to Cheeto, think again.
Cheeto may be sent along, either by the 25th Amendment, or because of Russian involvement with spewing false naratives undermining the democratic process of getting a President elected. Not to mention ties to Putin by Cheeto and his cabinet and son’s.
http://articles.latimes.com/1995-04-30/books/bk-60446_1_war-criminals-santa-monica-mcnamara
“So Robert McNamara is now a confessed war-criminal. David Halberstam, however, says that our U.S. war criminals should not be punished because “there was enough responsibility to go around for everyone involved.”
New York University gender switch Trump and Clinton debates:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=9yC7-JsR2Fk
They say the woman playing “Trump” would have won the election in a landslide and the male playing “Clinton” made it even more obvious all the double-talk going on.
This is opposite of the expected result from the experiment.
Socially interesting experiment.
I thought Hillary’s yelling was what decided the election. If a male copied that, he deserves an Oscar, Emmy, Tony, and 3 Grammies.
The Russian hacking that Marc Perkel claims never happened continues.
http://tennesseestar.com/2017/03/07/report-democrat-groups-paid-ransoms-to-hide-protester-funding/
You beat me to it, NFS… here’s the link to the original Bloomberg article.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-03-06/russian-hackers-said-to-seek-hush-money-from-liberal-u-s-groups
Does it make you feel good that you and the Russians are on the same side? 🙄
Don’t you pay attention? Latest Wikileaks says CIA stole Russian malware and uses it to blame the Russians. The evidence of Russian hacking comes from private parties who said they found fingerprints of Russian malware. Strangely it used English rather than Russian in certain places.
@McCullough, maybe, just Maybe, Heartless Cheney will spout out all the war crimes he’s responsible for. Then again I’m really doubtful the bastard has Any conciense or empathy.
Both parties have much to answer for.
President Obama with his hellfire missiles and kill list makes me sick. Although, we knew about his misgivings. With this current Admin., who knows what is to come and has already transpired.
Bill Clinton has his skeletons too. With that, what President has been saintly, BUT, some have had more of a deal with the devil.
Oh, btw I’m not religious, I just like to use the verbiage.
Links?
I know, I know… links are so boring, so evidence-related and reality-related, and reality has a well-known liberal bias. Best to stay with the feelings. You and Trumpy feel that the things you believe are true, and that’s good enough in wingnut world! 😀
Already been posted here. Pay attention…
Links? You think that’s truth? How would you know? You can’t handle the truth. Obviously.
I’m thinking of organizing a Trump protest. That way Trump will continue to stick with Republican conservatives to beat the liberals.
Good for you, NFS. While your fellow wingnuts have run for the hills, you have proudly remained, expressing your support for the big orange cheeto. (Well, you and pedrito, but he’s kind of incoherent.) I admire your courage, if not your intellectual competence. 😉
Could you explain your logic(peanut butter). You say wingnut, which means you think their positions are ridiculous. Then you say we will be upset with Trump. This means that you will be happy with Trump if he does something that people you consider wingnuts don’t like.
As far back as the Southern Strategy, the Republicans have conned gullible citizens into voting for them, then turn around and cut taxes on the rich (for example). Widely observed that when Reagan instituted tax cuts for the rich, claiming it would help everyone, he was lying. (David Stockman knew). Since 1980 the rich have become incredibly rich and the rest of us haven’t really done much better.
So just as you did with Dubya, you got conned by Republicans. When things went to shit because of Dubya’s incompetence/dishonesty (and Republican incompetence/dishonesty) y’all stopped worshiping Dubya and claimed that you always hated him.
As it will be with Trump. You worship him now, gullible wingnuts that you are, but eventually even your dim minds will comprehend that he’s a disaster in action. A Democrat will be elected to clean up the mess, and y’all will claim that you never liked Trump, he’s not a true conservative (as you said with Dubya).
Same old, same old. Gullible wingnuts being conned until even they can see how bad things are.
“Wingnut” is a pejorative term commonly used by political bloggers of a left bent to describe fervid exponents of right-wing (often extreme right-wing) political opinions and causes.”
So what the hell is “(peanut butter)”. Besides a sugary spread for late night snacks.
JP: so close. A spread you can put on anything to make children eat anything.
Your stumble so close proves its roots/utility. Re T.Rump I’s say goof balls or horse tranquilizers, but the dude don’t drink. Never trust a man who can’t trust himself drunk from time to time.
Who’s buying?
I’m leave you to figure it out. Kind of like Cockney slang. You might get a hint in the next 24 hrs, not from me.
You repeated my point. Presumably a wingnut in your view would want the big tax cuts. If they are against them then you wouldn’t find them nutty.
http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/246869-wikileaks-nsa-spied-on-brazils-president
Wire tap? What wire tap? Who the hell uses wires? Haven’t we all gone wire-LESS?!
Seems to me the bigger story isn’t so much who’s wire-tapping who — as repugnant as that is. Seems to me the bigger story is about what’s being said!
For example, we all know how the Russians “hacked” the DNC which some people think is why Hillary lost the election. But instead of focusing on what Hillary (and others) said in those hacked emails, which, by the way was all TRUE. The focus seems directed almost entirely at who did the hacking. So one is left with the question: would we be so focused about Russian hacking if it weren’t the Russians but instead someone like the ACLU or the NAACP who did the hacking? Would this whole hacking issue even BE a focus if we better knew what was said?!
That’s NOT to say Russian hacking should be ignored. I just can’t help wonder if any of this wire-tapping or hacking crap would even be center stage if the focus was more about what was said. Aren’t we essentially killing the (Russian) messenger?!
Do you (now) see how wire taps may be clouding bigger issues?
Could it be you’re being herded by a biased press corps?
‘Hacked the DNC’ is a separate hack from Hillary’s(Podesta’s) e-mails is separate from Hillary server.
I thought Cruz was excellent in the debates, letting Trump go on and on about how he is trouncing everyone in the polls, Cruz sitting their listening letting Trump extol. Then Cruz unleashes, “Donald loves the polls. That same poll he talks about has him losing to Hillary and me beating Hillary.”
Now Trump has outdone him. He went for months letting the media go on and on about how Russians worked with Trump to steal the election, and the FBI was investigating, and with one tweet, he points out how Obama was investigating his political opponents. Now the media is scrambling to rewrite history and say of course we never meant they were investigating Trump.
New York Times is even rewriting headlines in service to Big Brother.
https://twitter.com/cjtfarrell/status/839467997114822656/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc^tfw
note ‘intercepted’ is the current headline while wiretapped was the original headline.
Correction, as I told Andy McCarthy, the original online headline was different from the print headline. So no rewrite here.
Excellent article. I am facing many of these issues as well..