Before everyone starts screaming DENIER at me let me say up front that, yes – the Earth is getting hotter, and some of the reason is from humans. So here’s a few inconvenient facts that disturb me about some of the alarmist predictions about global warming.
- In the above graph (NOAA) you’ll notice that 0 represents about where we are now and where we are now is on the high side of normal over the last 400,000 years. The real normal appears to be ice age. Look to me if you buy the CO2 correlation that it would be bad if CO2 levels dropped. Perhaps I’m missing something.
- The man made increase in CO2 is 100 parts per million. That’s one part in 10,000 in the atmosphere. That’s not a lot of change. I have a hard time conceiving that one part in 10,000 is the difference between paradise and Venus.
- 100% of the coal and oil came from plants. The plants got 100% of their carbon from the air. Therefore at some time in the past 100% of the carbon from coal and oil was in the air. And yet Earth didn’t turn into Venus when CO2 was 100 times greater than today.
So – yes – we should reduce all forms of pollution and manage our resources. For example – the use of one condom can prevent 44,000 tons of CO2 as a result of an unwanted pregnancy. And we should move to solar power and electric cars. But to those who are saying Earth is going to turn into Venus I say you’re full of stuff.
http://forbes.com/sites/warrenmeyer/2010/10/15/denying-the-catstrophe-the-science-of-the-climate-skeptics-position/
I read the first page. Almost every single statement is a lie or an incredible quibble. I could go for the most error prone paragraph, but I don’t want to review it that long, so I’ll just take the first paragraph.
…………..But lets start with the source?==Forbes. A magazine for the Capitalist (RICH) class. GW is about SCIENCE======>NOT BUSINESS.
So, lets go:
In last week’s column, I lamented the devolution of the climate debate into dueling ad hominem attacks, /// I doubt the main source of info which is the IPCC organization has much ad hominem going on…… SEE the issue? Business and Politics trying to “take over” the climate debate…..which they have in Science Denying Jesus Loving USA. There is no significant debate within the science which is the only legitimate CONTEXT for analysis of the issue. NOT COVERED: which is subject to business and politics: what to do about AGW. Stop conflating similar but wholly different issues.
which has led in almost a straight line to the incredible totalitarian vision of the 10:10 climate group’s recent film showing school kids getting blown up for not adhering to the global warming alarmists’ position. /// Huh?
To you AGW deniers===you have all the credibility of any other solid science deniers. Flat Earth, Early Earth, Anti-Vacine, Angel Believers, Reliance on Prayer, Obama born in Kenya, Bush blew up WTC….oops, I done devolved into non consensus science issues.
Ima onlee hooman.
But lets start with the source?==Forbes. A magazine for the Capitalist (RICH) class. GW is about SCIENCE======>NOT BUSINESS.
So, lets go:
In last week’s column, I lamented the devolution of the climate debate into dueling ad hominem attacks,
So you say. You speak with such “authority”. 🙂
Typical liberal ad hominem knee jerk reaction. You can’t take it so you want to dish it out. 😀
EXCELLENT article.
Many thanks from a fellow skeptic.
For Marc (with a c, keep forgetting your spelling==not on purpose)
http://washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2015/02/12/this-new-tesla-battery-will-power-your-home-and-maybe-the-electric-grid-too/
I don’t think anyone “average” buys back up home generators for $20K==but anyone with solar cells should follow this technology?
Another chance to dump money on Elon too…… a two fer of sorts.
If there, I missed how this battery is a break through. Should use common metals, not exotics?
A breakthrough because they will build it in Nevada which is letting them be tax free for a decade or so including no payroll or property taxes, and lets them sell tax credits to other companies so they can avoid paying taxes as well.
True dat.
Good science, Good Business………..Bad social policy.
From your point (1) and plot you can see that CO2 and temperature are correlated and that small changes in CO2 has a strong effect.
Now, the problem with this plot is that it shows the last 400,000 years but you do not get to see where we are today. You need to plot specifically the last 200 years to see that the rightmost part of the plot should go up to 380ppm of CO2. Look where 380 would be and see how much higher this is then what you show. This is why people are freaking out.
There is no conspiracy.. just a lot of confusion and what seems to be an inherent push to keep confusing people instead of educating them and teaching them to understand plots.
from memory—we went over 400ppm about 6 months ago? It can only be higher now, unless those lying liars are just seeking research money.
My hunch….that 350ppm really is the tipping point. We are all doomed. As it goes up from there, its only the timing of the onset that changes.
…………………..we were………………. so close!
399.85 as measured in January.
The depressing thing: it takes about 1 minutes to find information like this now. It used to be so hard when I was young. We now have a lot of information at our fingertips. Some has to be vetted but it is pretty straightforward to figure things out what is what with multiple sources.
There used to be ignorant people before and they have now been replaced by a new generation of willfully ignorant people who just cannot bother. Many who are not willfully ignorant are just being overly cynical to excuse themselves from trying to figure things out.
That is the real shame.
I don’t think of Marc Perkel as cynical. Strikes me as more jovial and happy in his outlook.
We have lots of mental processes to look at?
Anthrogenesis
What humans do the Earth
Be men of Science.
I was not referring to Mark Perkel, whom I do not know and did not mean to imply that.
His post genially seemed to be asking a question, which is often asked, and I thought it was worth replying.
I agree…. most likely not thinking of MarC Perkel…but “in my view” he fits your description of being willfully ignornant (or agnostic or skeptical or not totally buying into, or agreeing then disagreeing in the same sentence) of AGW which is as you say ” pretty straightforward to figure things out what is what with multiple sources.” and I don’t think he is cynical.
So….cynical is part of the story, but the more interesting part(s) is something else?
The only willfully ignorant is you.
Perkel gets that they are exaggerating it.
Maybe.
I hear more reports the IPCC estimates understate the warming…
Point is—not you, not me, not Perkel understand GW enough to have any valid opinion at all.
…………makes it interesting to self evaluate how we form our conclusions.
I use the Best Science Available, the best risk management evaluation, admit I could be wrong….. and go from there.
What odd ball kook do you use to deny Science? Any particular one, or just any nay sayer?
……………………………… be……………… honest.
Take a closer look at the plot. Temperature is going up first.
What humans do to the earth.
((Darn went from a form/typo error to now perhaps a grammar error?….. But I am too lazy, not cynical, to look it up.))
Did ppm go down then?….more laziness.
Marc, you didn’t actually say anything about alarmists.
I thought the same thing
………..and then adjusted the zero point of the scale.
Something about alarmists that disturbs me is that they lie about hurricanes saying that they are caused by global warming. The latest IPCC SREX report demonstrated otherwise, yet the alarmists are out there announcing after ever storm, including snowfall that it is because of global warming. Roger Pielke Jr has been talking about this for about 10 years now, and finally got the IPCC to get it right, and the alarmists are still repeating the same false talking points to scare the gullible.
http://rogerpielkejr.blogspot.com/2012/03/handy-bullshit-button-on-disasters-and.html
Gullible about what?
I keep making this mistake. Did you know ‘gullible’ is not a real word? Look it up in a paper dictionary, and it will not be there.
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2015/02/14/a-new-study-shows-climate-skeptics-have-more-knowledge-on-climate-science-than-alarmists/
Not surprising when it is Perkel vs Bobbo.
Neither Perkel, you or me are qualified to speak on the subject. I do like your alternative subject to go after the words that are used to address the subject. I have about 5 dictionaries in the house.
From the google: quick to believe something that is not true. I take it you are employing the highest of irony (rather than sarcasm) to believe gullible is not a word?
Ha, ha.
If you are not qualified to speak on the subject, then don’t.
http://drroyspencer.com/2015/02/what-to-call-a-nyt-reporter-of-climate-science/
We are over 400ppm now. This chart shows us at 300ppm.
That red line therefore goes up twice as high as you are showing it and twice as high at any point in the history of that chart.
MikeN says:
2/13/2015 at 1:51 pm
But lets start with the source?==Forbes. A magazine for the Capitalist (RICH) class. GW is about SCIENCE======>NOT BUSINESS.
So, lets go:
In last week’s column, I lamented the devolution of the climate debate into dueling ad hominem attacks,
///// Stupid to do nothing but make an ad hominem attack while dedrying it use. Further, I rarely make “only” an ad hominem attack. You skipped over the substantive counter facts I provided. Lastly, its a fine line between ad hominem and stating a likely bias. You do know the difference???
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Guyver says:
2/19/2015 at 9:59 am
I read the first page. Almost every single statement is a lie or an incredible quibble.
So you say. You speak with such “authority” /// That ad hominem too. I speak with no authority as I have repeatedly posted…..but…I do have a number of stock SCIENCE BASED returns to the constant stupidity that gets posted denying science. Case by case.
To you AGW deniers===you have all the credibility of any other solid science deniers. Flat Earth, Early Earth, Anti-Vacine, Angel Believers, Reliance on Prayer, Obama born in Kenya, Bush blew up WTC….oops, I done devolved into non consensus science issues.
Ima onlee hooman.
Typical liberal ad hominem knee jerk reaction. You can’t take it so you want to dish it out. 😀 //// Stupid. I take all insults as I look for any factual matters that might be contained therein. Onlyl stupid people are insulted by being called stupid. People who aren’t so stupid…. are merely amused.
What BS, we still can’t farm in GreenLand. When we can farm in GreenLand, like the vikings I’ll take the Globalist Propaganda more serious, for now it just seems to be a way to make a few elitist rich and to keep the rest of us poor. Typical of the Rich to find a way to tax the air we breath.
Whatever………………………………………………………………………………….
Traaxx
If you look closely, you will see that the red line stops just short of the present. Our current CO2 level in the atmosphere is over 400 and climbing.
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