…it was supposed to fail. Perhaps it wasn’t perpetrated by the Quds Force but by a rival faction (and there are many in the mess of Iran politics) who wanted it to fail so they would be blamed or made to look bad because of its incompetence. Or perhaps the Quds did do it, but didn’t care if it succeeded or failed because either way, it would be made public and show the US that they were taking their violence to our streets. Or perhaps it’s a US op to get us into a war with Iran. Or…. Your ideas? Even US officials (non-White House, of course) think something is wrong with it.
The claim that Iran employed a used-car salesman with a conviction for cheque fraud to hire Mexican gangsters to assassinate the Saudi ambassador in Washington goes against all that is known of Iran’s highly sophisticated intelligence service.
The confident announcement of this bizarre plot by the US Attorney General Eric Holder sounds alarmingly similar to Secretary of State Colin Powell’s notorious claim before the UN in 2003 that the US possessed irrefutable evidence Saddam Hussein was developing weapons of mass destruction.
The problem is that the US government has very publicly committed itself to a version of events, however unlikely, that, if true, would be a case for war against Iran. It will be difficult for the US to back away from such allegations now.
Could the accusations be true? The plot as described in court was puerile, easy to discover and unlikely to succeed.
The fact it was so amateurish just proves how limited of a threat Iran is. I highly doubt it was any kind of trial run or any kind of test. The Country of Iran is a wannabe super power but it just does not have the skills to do it. I am more afraid of them buying mass destruction weapons and just using them without provocation. Iran is that unstable in both its religious leaders and its political ones.
Go back to sleep. You missed the important points. Better luck next time.
Well, maybe … But why take chances. We better attack them anyway đ
you my friend, sound like the perfect .gov war machine shill.
good luck with that.
-s
dude — I bet you belong to the set of people who think bin laden was JUST killed and not dead for at least 8 years. You no doubt, vote Republican or Democrat every national election.
Personally, I blame North Korea.
Top 5 List of Faked Acts of War
5 – The Soviets burned the German Parliament building. WRONG
4 – The USS Maine was sunk by a Spanish torpedo or mine. “Remember the Maine!” WRONG
3 – Iraq was responsible for the 9/11 attacks, with their yellowcake and stuff. “Remember 9/11” WRONG
2 – Vietnam aggressors sunk our PT boats in the Gulf of Tonkin in the dead of night. “When they stand up, we’ll stand down.” WRONG
1 – NYC cops just want to sanitize the park a bit, so protesters should please just step out for a moment, and then they can come right back again, and NYC cops will gladly defend their Constitutional rights. WRONG
Actually it was the destroyer USS Maddox it was not sunk and there were no US casualties.
har har.. like i said a few days ago, this is yet another comedic fabrication by the three letter agencies.
The WH holding the news for release at the most politically profitable (and distractive) time only makes it that much more obvious.
-s
Why?
Why is it the problem of the USA, the American Taxpayer, and every other citizen, what Iran does to a Saudi citizen?
If Saudi wants to attack Iran, fine.
But why is it my government’s issue?
because the us has to dominate the world! Have’nt you figured that out so far? Because the usa knows what is good for the world, despite all the mass murdering, hunger problems, chaos of all kinds going on here! We know what’s best for all of humanity. LOL! NOT
Ummmm…..
because it was going to take place in my frikin neighborhood on US soil!
Didn’t the CIA work with the Mafia to assassinate Castro? The only difference here is that our CIA did not initially contact an undercover agent who was secretly working for Castro. Samo-samo!
The “real” fabrication here is claiming that Iran is “sophisticated” in its foreign espionage. Few countries are. All are out of their element. Espionage to borrow a phrase: is hard. Much much easier to herd sheep.
These rules are universal–across time and culture.
Yea, verily.
An interesting story. If it is true and happened it would be a powerful message to the Saudis that the US cannot protect them. To the US it might be a signal that Iran is willing to go after the Saudis if we attempt to topple them with something like our Libyan adventure. Almost like Chicago rules… we threaten to go after the Syrians and they threaten to go after the Saudis.
jescott418 is wrong that Iran is a wannabe superpower. Their economy is crap outside of oil/gas. They do want to be a major regional player though.
Let’s parse:
An interesting story. /// Yes. Politics/diplomacy/perceived self interest. Countries acting on power rather than rights or morals.
If it is true and happened it would be a powerful message to the Saudis that the US cannot protect them. /// The plot was foiled–how is that not protecting the House of Saud and the USA as well?
To the US it might be a signal that Iran is willing to go after the Saudis if we attempt to topple them /// Iran wants to topple Saudi Arabia regardless of any other consideration. Its a religious thing having nothing to do with the USA. Don’t be confused by coincidence. Likewise, USA is actively engaged in trying to topple the Iranian Government. Where you been?
with something like our Libyan adventure. /// You mean weakly at the last moment support a popular revolution. Yes that is quite a threat.
Almost like Chicago rules⊠we threaten to go after the Syrians and they threaten to go after the Saudis. // Thats no Chicago Rule I’ve ever heard of even if your string of causation wasn’t totally wrong.
jescott418 is wrong that Iran is a wannabe superpower. Their economy is crap outside of oil/gas. They do want to be a major regional player though. /// Some people define being a super power, or at least a wanna be as anyone that develops a nuclear capability and most certainly one coupled with an intercontinental delivery system. Your analysis of capability does not even address the fantasies of a religiously obsessed fascist government.
Gee Chris, other than getting every single fact wrong—good post.
Where are these “facts” that you speak of?
Some of our people are accusing some of their people of planning something that didn’t happen. That’s pretty thin.
You’re talking about a country whose government org-chart looks like a spiderweb. What does it really mean that ‘they’ did it, or didn’t do it? Not much at all, I think.
The diffuse nature of Iran’s power structure has a dual nature. They can’t really operate in a coherent way because there are too many hands involved, but it does create a lot of durability.
Even if the ‘Arab Spring’ becomes the ‘Persian Winter’ do you really believe that the clerics are going to be removed entirely from power? There is no single point of failure like the Mubarak family in Egypt or the Assad family in Syria.
What strikes me as off about this story is that, to the extent you can talk of the clerics as a cohesive group, it runs counter to their long-term goals.
Iran’s long term strategic moves seem to be more about playing for time. The US is eventually going to leave the region in a major way, which clears Iran to be the lead regional power. The strongest actor influencing Iran’s rise has been the US.
There is ample precedent for Iran using third parties for attacks in the Western hemisphere, so you can’t discount it completely. Los Zetas are a bunch of maniacs though, so it looks too amateur to me.
On a personal note, I thought you threatened to leave due to the blog redesign. Whatever happened to that?
Let’s parse:
Where are these âfactsâ that you speak of? //Quibbling is weak. Not every parse is based on a factual error. some are based on errors of logic.
Some of our people are accusing some of their people of planning something that didnât happen. Thatâs pretty thin. /// More quibbling and logic errors: certain “things” did happen. Consider the entirety of an issue.
Youâre talking about a country whose government org-chart looks like a spiderweb. What does it really mean that âtheyâ did it, or didnât do it? Not much at all, I think. /// “It” means: the spider web did it. Are you so easily misled by an organizational chart?===Haw Haw!!!!!
The diffuse nature of Iranâs power structure has a dual nature. They canât really operate in a coherent way because there are too many hands involved, but it does create a lot of durability. /// You strongly imply now that this dual nature spider web could have done as charge now or do you have any clear point in mind?
Even if the âArab Springâ becomes the âPersian Winterâ do you really believe that the clerics are going to be removed entirely from power? /// Negating absolutes huh. Very weak argument style. No, the clerics will never be removed entirely from power. Well==maybe when the sun goes super nova. Absolute enough for you?
There is no single point of failure like the Mubarak family in Egypt or the Assad family in Syria. //// So what? They also aren’t trying to smoke baklava as if it was a cigarette.
What strikes me as off about this story is that, to the extent you can talk of the clerics as a cohesive group, it runs counter to their long-term goals. /// So you would do things differently and no one doing anything else is credible? So, in that light its not credible that the USA let assault weapons be sold into Mexico? Its not not consistent with the long terms goals of America’s need for jobs for the Republican Party to do nothing but restrict a woman’s right to abortion or contraception? You are evaluating reality based on your sense of pragmatism? Again: HAW, HAW!!!
Iranâs long term strategic moves seem to be more about playing for time. /// Meaningless fluff on the order of Dvorak claiming the changes here are for “modernization.” Even if granted for some sort of insight, does this mean countries don’t have short term tactical moves?
The US is eventually going to leave the region in a major way, which clears Iran to be the lead regional power. The strongest actor influencing Iranâs rise has been the US. /// So, the nations bordering them with a different competing religion aren’t much of an issue huh?
There is ample precedent for Iran using third parties for attacks in the Western hemisphere, so you canât discount it completely. /// So why do you?
Los Zetas are a bunch of maniacs though, so it looks too amateur to me. /// How is it different than the admitted to use of the Mafia by the CIA? The plot if true failed because of the amateurish approach? Or- the plot failed having nothing to do with the use of Los Zetas. Which failure of logic do you prefer?
On a personal note, I thought you threatened to leave due to the blog redesign. Whatever happened to that? /// My dual nature spider web is still playing out its long term immature considerations. Don’t discount it.
xxxxxxxxx On a personal note, you would do well to consider alternatives/balance before concluding on a subject. As stated, it is also disastrous to apply inappropriate/irrelevant diagnostic to admitted complex unknown issues. If something is possible, and you actually don’t know anything, why doubt it? Likewise, if something is improbable, and you actually don’t know anything, why champion it?
No one is denying that $100K was transferred from one agencies of the Iranian Government to operatives in the USA that are part of this plot. What pragmatic long term sense does that make?
I post to encourage you to keep your powder dry.
You: So, the nations bordering them with a different competing religion arenât much of an issue huh?
Me: Like who? Go look at a map and tell me who is playing an international role NOT as a puppet, but as a direct actor.
You:Meaningless fluff on the order of Dvorak claiming the changes here are for âmodernization.â
Me: Not so much. Sanctions weaken over time. Progress on their weapons programs happen over time. The US loses interest in Iraq/Afghanistan over time.
Iran’s strategic actions, to me, appear to be more about creating the prospect of massive disruption if the US/Israel take action against them. That’s why they have moved into energy transport, threaten the straights of Hormuz, and help all the regional knuckleheads. They don’t want to fight… but if we do they can make a big mess.
Thing is, bobbo, that I try to understand the world. That is going to be imperfect because I don’t have perfect information or reasoning. What gets me is that you don’t appear to see real world situations as anything more than debate team. Style over substance every time.
Try knowing more things.
DVORAK====PLEASE FIX THIS BLOG!!!!
THE NESTING IS ONLY FOUR DEEP MAKING REPLIES OUT OF ORDER.
IF YOU CANT NEST PROPERLY====GO BACK TO NO NEST UNTIL YOU CAN F**** IT UP PROPERLY.
Lets parse one more time:
You: So, the nations bordering them with a different competing religion arenât much of an issue huh?
Me: Like who? Go look at a map and tell me who is playing an international role NOT as a puppet, but as a direct actor. //// This is so meaningless and pointless I can only guess at what you are trying to say. Iran is in a contest with Saudi Arabia to be the regional power as you said over the issue of which sect of Muslim Religion will take the lead. Iran was in a 12 plus year hot war with Iraq over religion, military power, territory, and leadership. No reason not to think that is continuing now in preparation for when USA declares victory and goes home.
xxxxxxxxx
You:Meaningless fluff on the order of Dvorak claiming the changes here are for âmodernization.â
Me: Not so much. Sanctions weaken over time. Progress on their weapons programs happen over time. The US loses interest in Iraq/Afghanistan over time. /// Completely irrelevant. Again–I can’t even tell what point you are trying to make. You are being completely unfocused.
xxxxxxxxxx
Iranâs strategic actions, to me, appear to be more about creating the prospect of massive disruption if the US/Israel take action against them. /// How is that point made by assassinating Sauid’s Ambassador? Could you link those dots?
Thatâs why they have moved into energy transport, threaten the straights of Hormuz, and help all the regional knuckleheads. They donât want to fight⊠but if we do they can make a big mess. /// Thats what their geographic position means huh? Their providing missiles and weapons to Hezbolla is to show they will create massive disruption if they are bombed into the stone age? Silly.
Thing is, bobbo, that I try to understand the world. /// Yes—and you have a long way to go.
That is going to be imperfect because I donât have perfect information or reasoning. /// Check.
What gets me is that you donât appear to see real world situations as anything more than debate team. /// And the error in being able to debate a geopolitical point as opposed to admitting you don’t have perfect information or reasoning is what?
Style over substance every time. /// Your style is authoritative without rationale. That is lack of substance. You cannot have substance when you make conclusion admitting you don’t have the information or the logic to make the lift. And that was my advice to you. Don’t turn a suspicion or a notion into a conclusion as you do.
Makes you look like an empty suit.
Try knowing more things. /// Every day.
“Iran is in a contest with Saudi Arabia to be the regional power as you said over the issue of which sect of Muslim Religion will take the lead. Iran was in a 12 plus year hot war with Iraq over religion, military power, territory, and leadership.”
Iraq is going to go restart a “hot war” with Iraq using what army? They are a hopeful maybe at being able to control their OWN territory, except large parts in the North(Kurd), West(Sunni), and South(Shia) where authority goes much more strongly to local authorities.
The Saudi’s are cash rich and have a powerful uncle, but they are also the perfect example of the total welfare economy. Most of the cash comes from oil, and most of the oil jobs are done by outsiders. Money pees down from above mostly not based on ability. The Saudi’s avoided an “Arab Spring” by tossing a ton of money into the economy as well as well as the standard internal security crackdown. It worked this time.
Everyone else around Iran are third tier villains at best.
Time is on their side.
Me: Thing is, bobbo, that I try to understand the world.
You: “/// Yesâand you have a long way to go.”
Be fair, it is a big subject.
“Makes you look like an empty suit.”
I don’t often wear a suit, but I have nice selection of quality dress shirts. You tend to instruct people how best to reformat their arguments rather than openly disagree with them. That makes you look like an asshole.
Iran has financial problems at the moment, between the sanctions and payments to keep the various insurgents in potassium nitrate, etc. They just cut off Hezbollah to the tune of a few hundred million.
This will inevitably lead to the need for Iran to find a cause to rally around in their dire economic times (smoke and mirrors). The most expedient way to accomplish this is pick a fight with someone. Since the west is hated by a number of factions in the region they probably feel this will engender support for the cause. Too bad for the Iranian people unless they can overthrow the government in time.
What is fact is this story has enough ingredients to support the diabolical plots living in each of your sheeple minds!
Or it could all be just more ya-ya by one “side” or the other to keep you peckerheads busy expressing your “opinions” while they steal the whole world out from under your feet.
“Good news, Citizens of Oceania!”
“Bad news, Citizens of Oceania!”
“Good news, Citizens of Oceania!”
Enjoy your “news”, comrade.
No mature, sane country ever would stoop so low as to try something this dumb (iraq war, exploding cigar).
Could the WH be trying to fake something up to justify something or other? With this bunch of clowns running things the answer has to be yes.
Could Iran be trying to create a major stink to get the home team to rally around the flag and stop trying to subvert the government? Why not they seem to have done it before more than once.
/humour-silly rant
Hmm..
I think i see now how they manged to turn any old patzi’s mere discussion (empty at that) of committing so called terrorist acts into these magnanimous plots that FBI supposedly foils, into hard “facts” -when no bombs etc, ever existed.
-as well as why they are phasing out al-qaeda terror dudes in favour of homegrown domestic (lone wolf) terror dudes as the #1 threat we should all be scared blind with.
-they handily redefined terror way back in 2001 for just this purpose.
(all part of the script, i suppose)
—
item 1 of dictionary.com’s definition of terrorism: (my emphasis)
1. the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, especially for political purposes.
While in section 802 of the patriot act they watered down the definition so it could be left open to interpretation. (great law writing there, don’t ya think?)
—-
From section 802:
(5) the term `domestic terrorism’ means activities that–
(A) involve acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State;
(B) appear to be intended–
(i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
(ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or
(iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping; and
http://ratical.com/ratville/CAH/Section802.html#802
—-
“appear to be intended??”
-what tea-leave law crockery is this?
(also devilishly clever how they snuck in assassination, “mass” destruction and kidnapping as well. -i wonder if “kitchen sink” will turn up in a keyword search as well..)
Depending on how warped the motives of the person(s) judging the “appearance and intentions” of the accused are, -one could easily trump up opening charges on someone (or anyone) who is just talking in hypotheticals, etc..
-all that’s left to be done is call in the “Framers” to size up the mark and presto! – a year later we will have been saved yet again by some egomaniacal three letter agency who hand-held and spoon-fed the mark with every article required for a week or two’s worth of terror copy and saber rattling.
(-or they’ll just get “droned” and maybe we’ll be treated with some nifty missile-cam footage to make us feel all *inert meme of the week*)
and i’m sure that’ll open the door for another 100+ pages of terror amendments to be inserted into some unrelated bill at midnight on December 24th, -to make us all the more “safe” of course..
eesh..
/end humour
-s
(mind you, i have no doubt that the three letter agency “boots on the ground” do good, honorable work and have saved our bacon many, many times, -it’s the maniacs at the at the top with money sticking out their holes and handing out the marching orders that need to be exposed and brought to justice. if justice in fact, still exists, that is..)
Maybe this Iran/assassination affair is nothing more than phase two of “Operation Fast and Furious”. You know, the emergence PR Op. intended to distract the sheeple’s attention from the dozens and dozens of felonies committed by the administration during the first phase.
is it just me or does that logo in this image look a bit like the logo used for the old 80s band Twisted Sister?
Actually their symbol reminds me more of the soundtrack album cover art of the movie Exodus, of 1960. That was about the Israelis landing in Cypress, I think. And then establish their State from there. Likely, by force.
http://cduniverse.com/productinfo.asp?pid=2240310
The “rifle” as it’s depicted in the 60s cover art, is pretty vague. Possibly it was deliberate. Plausible denial. “No that’s not a gun. It’s a horn, or a club.” Yeah right. Anyway the Quds Force weapon is drawn much better. But the rest of the imagery is a mishmash of symbolism. There’s a leafy branch sticking up out of a globe, and what looks like a Menorah symbol (a candle?). Anyway, there’s a lot of script explaining itself. You’re usually in trouble, when your flag has to resort to a lengthy explanation.
Who are these “Quds” people anyway?? Sounds like something cows would eat. Oops…sorry…forgot that it’s some tribal group with a different language that thinks differently than mine. I should work on trying to “understand” them and their culture better.
You know, I think I’d be into that, if it were somehow could be established as more of a two-way street. Seems to me these folks are just plain tired of historically dealing with white Europeans, who one-sidedly oppressed them for centuries.
“Why cawn’t these bloody wogs speak English??” etc. etc.
They’re friggin ANGRY about all that, and are now just flailing around about it. They’re just the same people as us in the DNA and whatnot. Somehow there needs to be a New Overall Greater Awareness of these types of differences and how to resolve them.
I still like their music, though.
George Bush probably would have resorted to something this minor to drum up support for the war in Iraq. But then 9-11 happened. And Cheney and he, took advantage of that instead. Along with Powell and his WMD “evidence”. In fact Powell’s WMD report was probably all Bush/Cheney had, at the time. But then they used it as icing on the 9-11 cake, to get the US into Iraq.
Now some boobs in Iran (maybe) are playing terrorists. And the DoD is worried their war budget might be winding down. If they don’t come up with a new “enemy” and reason to invade somewheres. And why involve Mexico? It reminds me a little of that supposedly intercepted cable, before WW2, between Hitler and Mexico (or another South American nation) about plans to carve up the USA. And the UK supplied that one, sent to the US Congress, to get the US involved in their war. Again. But I have my doubts that Hitler was really that stupid to cable his plans, years in advance. Risking discovery.