Finally, someone tells us the real reason why voting machines are not audited. It’s about time someone testified about this. That said, this guy has a few dubious answers.
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Voting machine fraud is really the GOP’s plan B and way too risky. Memories of Watergate….
Plan A is merely to outspend in sheeple brainwashing. The GOP has already installed a Supreme Court that allows for UNLIMITED spending on elections. Which by the way. is Karl Rove’s gig for the last couple of years…
So, if say 200,000 people contribute $20 for say, Ron Paul ($4M). Then Karl calls Exxon to get a check for 1 Billion. How do you like them apples, Ron?
Someone better get this guy to a safe-house and a mic to spill the beans further.
Didn’t Greg Palast write about this (and post/link to this testimony) years ago?
The outcome of elections no longer matters. Most people don’t vote. 50% of the population do not pay Federal income tax. Corporations make campaign donations to both parties. Why should the results matter?
Did anyone really believe it wouldn’t be easy to rig electronic voting machines? At least with mechanical ones you had to put your hands on each one to rig it.
We trashed perfectly good mechanical machines to comply with current law and spent money on piece of shit electronic ones. Harder to use and easier to hack.
100% scam from the beginning to get more tax payer money.
Electronic voter machines are just another step to take the voters out of the loop. The latest being, of course, the Supreme Court’s decision to allow unlimited money in elections and lobbying. Thanks guys.
Chuck, it’s not about election results, it about corruption. As Clinton (Curtis?) said, election fixing is small potatoes compared to what else he has witnessed. Vote tampering in Ohio is but one thread in a massive cobweb of deceit throughout your entire government-corporate infrastructure. Voters don’t vote anymore because so many politicians are liars that one can only presume that every politician is a liar. The backlash against large corporations, despite the fact that they provide jobs and an economy, is that their ONLY mandate as a “legal individual” is to create wealth for their shareholders. That kind of thinking, bereft of empathy or conscience, is what leads to corruption and collusion with their partner in government.
Regarding money and elections. In todays world it is relatively easy to find out a candidates position on all most anything. So the amount of money spent on adds shouldn’t matter much at all.
The problem is 90% of the population is either to lazy or to dumb to spend any time to find out what is bullsh** and what isn’t. So unfortunately we deserve what we get.
The way it works now is:
Half the population doesn’t care enough to even bother to find out what the issues are and who best represents their interest and doesn’t vote at all.
The other half is dump enough to be influenced by negative 30 sec TV adds and votes based on half truths and outright lies.
Bottom line is until the voters change the politicians wont.
This will give the Democrats in Chicago a chance to upgrade their voting tactics from counting dead peoples’ votes to a more modern digital use of fraud.
#4 Chuck
Maybe that’s becasue 45% aren’t making any “real” money.
The top 10% hold over half the wealth. Average incomes have remained flat since the 70’s
None of these things are good for Americans.
Breaking news: a computer can be programmed to deliberately miscount votes.
UN election inspectors from Cuba, heading to Ohio in 2012?
Oh and by the way, we did stuff for NASA and this little Chinese guy …
Well, of course Stalin was right, whether he actually said:
“I consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote, or how; but what is extraordinarily important is this — who will count the votes, and how.”
or not.
Of course, he’d never been to Chicago.
As MARC ANDREESSEN says in his Wall Street Journal article, it’s all about the software. It’s now the new weapon of choice. Neal Stephenson’s Snow Crash has become real. The referred video series above should give you a gimps of what is also happening in our so-called free markets on Wall Street. It’s ALL software, all proprietary, all hidden,and with inept oversight by the SEC. Your life’s savings are just flashing numbers on a screen subject to a possible wipe by rouge software programming. Dvorak, you’re opening doors that ….. well, you know.
In # 10 tcc3 said: The top 10% hold over half the wealth.
Its actually only 400 individuals (real people,) who control 50% of this country’s wealth. (400 of them = 180,000,000 of us. [Believe me, they don’t visit web sites. {The hire people to visit websites. (They don’t watch porno, they have porno done for them in the privacy of their own estates.)}])
If we extend this to the 1,200 wealthiest people, (all of whom are tracked by name by the IRS by the way,) you’d be sickened at how little is actually left for the middle class.
Its no wonder that the ‘States is sixtieth in the distribution of wealth and dropping like a stone.
In # 15whitedog said: …wipe by rouge software programming>/i>…
I’m sure you meant rogue.
rouge just means a shade of lipstick.
Elections rigged? Geez, ya think?
Stalin was right.
Its not the votes that count, its the tallies, and the talliers.
# 15 whitedog, # 17 msbpodcast
Rouge, lipstick, mascara, whatever, it may be an appropriate metaphor — it’s all just a cover-up.
I say it’s time to hand over the running of elections and counting of votes to Consumer Reports. (The most trustworthy organization I can think of at the moment. Any other nominations?)
I predict this guy is going to slip in the stairwell of a large multi-story building.
Not to detract from it, but this video is not new, it’s from 2004.
More info, transcript:
http://forum-soxprospects.com/topic/2175/Election-Hacking-Clinton-Curtis-Testimony-Ohio-2004
Maybe liberals shouldn’t have pushed so hard for electronic voting machines. Lose one election with punch card ballots, and you go gaga for the latest and greatest unproven method.
Here’s his Wikipedia page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clint_Curtis
He (a former Republican) ended up running for office in 2006 and 2010 after all that (as a Democratic candidate in FL and CA).
Here’s a follow up video.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=K7tjnuG-l6g
#22 MikeN
Its not the electronics, its the accountability.
We need machines that aren’t patented black boxes that can be hacked with a thumbdrive and made by a company whose president stated publicly that he’d do anything he could to get W elected.
An open system with a public review of the code would be a good start. We don’t control our elections as long as Corporations hide behind IP law.
I remain forever skeptical of the veeracity of our voting systems. If they can be cheated, they will be.
Come on now! These e-voting systems can be made quite foolproof. First, you need a triple-redundant systems from three different sources:
one is locally chosen (county/state), 2nd is from any of the participating party chosen system thru random pick (not necessary GOP/Dem always), and 3rd one is from a non-profit org that may be federally-funded to choose and operate its own system (which may be different from time to time). All must be from different manufacturers and connected to the same input streams.
There can’t be any statistically significant difference for results to be valid! Period! You don’t need to examine source code.
If there is, replay the input stream and you can pinpoint which one is flaky.
Coupled with pre-voting secure installation process and post-voting polling, cheating would be extremely difficult if not impossible.
Wild ideas? I’d say it’s workable.
@Cat2
And the cost of such a system…
Our local township was forced to buy a $5000 electronic voting machine. It has been a pain to keep operating. We typically have about 800-1000 voters in a presidential election and less than 500 for medterm and local elections.
The machine is used for less than 50% of the voting. Most people instinctively chose the paper ballot, not trusting the machine.
Paper and pencils are CHEAP! I say stick with what works.
Foolish people. Here you are moaning about election machIne fraud which is nothing compared to allowing UNLIMITED money poured to campaigns – without accountability.
It is astonishing the apathy to that and the outrage at this silly shit. Incredible.
@two to the head:
What’s the price for our democracy?
I’d say it’s still cheap. I don’t know why anyone think it’s expensive: cheap hardware, simple counting software …
The old system relies too much on integrity of the people running the show behind the counter! When and where that has been the case, it’s fine. But we know better now. The old system is too prone for foul play (I’d bet that has been much more common in the past – not the exception) and painfully slow.
Not everything from the past is worth preserving, my friend … unless you’re with the status quo.
i know a guy from a maker of voting machines, he said these things are so easy to break into it is ridiculous… and that they were made that way intentionally.