At least we can get back debating… well, anything else.
One option is coin seigniorage—aka, the “really-huge-coin workaround.” The United States has a statutory limit on the amount of paper money in circulation, but no such limit on coins. The Treasury secretary has the authority to mint certain coins of any denomination, with no need for the value of the metal to equal the value of the coin. (It gets a bit technical.) But the idea is that Secretary Timothy Geithner could order the Mint to make a, say, $5 trillion coin. It could then use the coin to buy back and extinguish debt from the Fed, pushing the country back under the ceiling. Or it could deposit it, and the Fed could counteract the inflation by selling government debt.
It is only when Americans email , phone and harass their elected officials – congressmen and senators that this immoral game is up
The game is over, you had better stop this beltway crap or its curtains for you
“DO YOU UNDERSTAND”
This two party James Carville spin stuff is over
No more of these talking points
You are not safe if you are an elected republican either
Just because you are a Republican does not make you safe
Either get with the program and serve your country and your constituents or you are out on you ass as well
What a corrupt bunch
What an evil president along with the rest of the elected officials of the old school
It is said that the second oldest profession are politicians
Either get with the program or you are out
Be sure of that
The game is over gentlemen
#27–Animby==I can see you are honestly struggling with the truth, but maybe you just can’t handle the truth? How bout some foam?
Debt is caused when Congress and Pres approve spending in excess of revenue. Note specifically that increasing the debt limit contains neither term.
Yes, words have a meaning and a context. I thought yesterday, and think again, that you and I share so many values the same. The only reason we define ourselves on either side of the political fault line is because I see things clearly whereast you have been caught by the right wing spin meisters. THIS is such a topic.
Words have meaning and a context.
I won’t even argue that raising the debt ceiling will or won’t cause an increase in debt. You have the definition. It doesn’t fit yet you continue to argue your little dogma. How about this? Your fried rice and donkey ball soup tonight for dinner will also cause the debt to increase? You see my point? Post hoc ergo Proper hoc. Animby, why do you so rightly reject this fallacy until it fits your prejudices?
Yes, words have meaning and a context.
Lets see, to be fair, did you say “cause?” …. No. Ha, ha: “lead to.” So, you didn’t ignore that angel of truth on your left shoulder, but couldn’t quite ignore the devil either?
What is it that we call people who compromise what they know the truth to be for old and comfortable ruts???? Pedro has a word for it.
“We don’t have a tax problem, we have a spending problem.”
Yes, indeedy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stone_money
bobbo: “Spending in deficit is unfair/doesn’t work.”
On the contrary, it has helped our country (and many others) become as healthy and wealthy as it is (they are) for hundreds of years. Eking out that extra few percent contributes to the health, welfare and education of our population and is invaluable when we need to vanquish those who wish to destroy us. The problem only comes when indulged in to too great a degree.
foobar: “Here’s an off the wall crazy idea. How about grownup planning and management?”
I don’t know if we, as a country, are capable of that at the moment.
Rob Peter, pay Paul.
#32–Uncle==why start by saying “to the contrary” when a full read of your position is in agreement?
Makes no sense. Short term/long term/general rules/exceptions.
You know what I said—same as you said.
Lets BALANCE THE BUDGET. Balance = reduce spending + take back what the Rich have stolen.
tick, tock.
@#35 bobbo
What the rich have stolen.
Congratulations, you are dangerously close to a personal epiphany. You won’t be happy until you have taken everything the rich own, same as they won’t be happy till they have taken everything you own.
Given your attitude, the only meaningful difference between you and them is that they are much more effective than you. Celebrate, for you are officially a poor rich man!
#29, That’s something quite a few people have a hard time gasping.
That is how the wealth transfer takes place. Those who have access to that money at the beginning get the full value. Those of us who buy a TV get the depreciated value because the number dollars needed to buy it has gone up.
They gripe about eating the rich then support the very mechanism that allowed the rich to get that way because of some silly campaign slogan and a political party.
I wish more people would read from mises.org. They would understand this wealth xfer mechanism and would never support a debt increase again.
And make no mistake — I don’t trust the republicans right now either. They would raise it in a heartbeat if the Tea Party wasn’t riding their ass.
One solution to the crapfest going on in congress is to stop paying for it and to stop first with paying for congress.
I bet there would be a lot less interest if the bums had to do it for free.
We save a shit load of money if we could just take the whole load of congress critters, senators and the president and force them to not try to become rich at our expense.
Ridiculously enough, that’s a part of the Tea Party platform, but it doesn’t go far enough.
George Washington was a farmer, not a career politician.
Get rid of all career politicians. Get rid of K Street. (Bulldoze the whole fuckin’ street and turn into a nice long park.)
There is a much easier solution to ALL of this. Do away with the “debt ceiling”. Problem solved. Then it will NEVER be an issue again. Can we get back to worrying about the tragic death of Amy Winehouse now?
Raising the debt ceiling limit is like raising the limit on a credit card. It does not change the fact that you are spending more than you take in. Our creditors expect to get paid and so do seniors, etc.
If it becomes clear as it should have years ago that not everybody can be given what is and has been promised then the spending binge should have been over.
In the short term we can pay the interest on our loans while we continue to borrow to run the government and meet other obligations. However we are pushing into dark and murky waters and I’d knock down our ratings for short term bonds and give us a Z on long term bonds.
The Reps would love to balance the budget, at least in theory, while the Dems claim that the universe will end unless we keep charging into deeper debt.
The bottom line is that anything the Dems will accept still means we are doomed. The Reps were doing a little better but they were no where near actually avoiding disaster either so get you hard hat on and try to figure some way you and your loved ones can get food, clothing, and shelter while we have a total economic melt down sometime in the next few years.
Take care and may God bless and keep you.
lol, that coin will just and up in Monty Burns pocket!
Somebody,
Interesting video. Pure crap, but interesting.
Basically, let’s all go back to the gold standard and Sharia Law!!
Go back to the gold standard and use coins only? Not enough gold in the world to do this.
Sharia Law? Yea, we want Sharia Law. Even devout Muslims with any money didn’t obey this. For centuries Muslims used Jews to process financial transactions because Jews could charge Usury while Muslims could not.
A millennia old workaround.
Wow they cut a deal, at the last moment no less, color me surprised.
# 42 Ah_Yea said,”A millennia old workaround.” Yes, indeed. Islam forbids charging interest! Yet, there are Islamic banks? How does that work? No interest loans but they charge a monthly fee for the use of their money.
Sometimes Mohammad just cries…
#36–jolly==whatsamadderyou? So many people can only maintain their dogma by running everything they hear/read/see thru their little spin machine. I didn’t say or mean “take everything” from the rich. I did say and mean “take what they have stolen.” That was hyperbolic humor for “taxes.”
The rich benefit and require so much more from society than the poor. Tax everyone to provide national security, police, and fire. what are they “really” protecting? Banks, homes, cars? If I have no money in the bank, no home, and a moped, isn’t it the rich who benefit from and should pay the lion’s share to protect such assets?
Yes–who “owns” America and needs it protected? Wealth is created by labor and transfered to capital. Thats how class warfare begins–right from the start.
Here’s a personal epiphany: respond to what is actually said.
No phone calls required.
#42 Ah_Yea said:
“Interesting video. Pure crap, but interesting.
Basically, let’s all go back to the gold standard and Sharia Law!!”
I hope you saw both videos. I obviously don’t agree with your assessment.*
But the question I would ask is, if Africa wants to trade in the dinar, should the fact that YOU disagree force a violent confrontation?
Would that justify the war in Libya?
It is a serious question because it is the real reason that “we” can’t get along with the Muslim world.
*And there is no point in rehashing this:
http://mises.org/efandi/ch17.asp
or this:
http://mises.org/media/6544/The-Ethics-of-Money-Production
Well thank goodness we don’t have to worry about minting that coin now. A compromise has been reached that assures that we won’t have listen to the news agencies drone on about the “Debt Ceiling” day after day after day…. until after the 2012 elections. But I am sure that date is just a coincidence.
http://latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-debt-talks-20110801,0,3461991.story
The Tea Party and MoveOn.org both think the deal is immoral. We have agreement!
Next on the agenda: cutting the US’s credit rating. No implications there, right?
Fubar – “We have agreement!” Hah! Thanks for that.
I wonder if Moody’s and S&P’s will go ahead and downgrade our credit. It will be fun to watch the tap dances then as they explain why their wonderful compromise didn’t save our AAA+ status.
Politics would be so much fun if they didn’t screw so many people.
$240B/yr in cuts.
$1.2T/yr in spending.
“Cowboys & Aliens. Congress?”
Steve Martin on Twitter
It’s estimated that Boner and the Teabaggers have already raised the interest on the debt by 1/10th of a percent.
About $130B more in interest. Boner has agreed that amount shall come out if the defense budget. Yeah right.
Dallas, you need to work on your math skills and and stop parroting your glorious leaders.
How much extra interest do you think $2.4T is going to cost? Hmmm?
# 44 Animby said:
“Sometimes Mohammad just cries…”
Sure, there was hypocrisy where money was concerned. That was no threat to the system. The rising tide of Islamic fundamentalism, however, is a clear threat to the system.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=moQOFxMxTOM
As one person I read stated aptly, “In no way did we reduce spending. We simply reduced the increase in spending. Make no mistake. Spending went up just by a little less.”
Show me a fiscal year where the national debt dropped and I’ll show you a year when we actually had a balanced budget.