Mr. Fusion says:

Asshole

We should lobby the US Congress impeach the President unless he publishes a certified birth certificate proving he is an American Citizen.

Sure. Show the American public how dedicated the Republicans are to making the Congress work.

Congress wouldn’t have a leg to stand on. Read your copy of the Constitution.

MikeN says:

#64 bobbo,
I am not trying to prove that he was born in Kenya. I am analyzing granite’s case. Parts of it are good, but that part is a weak case. I think you can see that someone who is in Kenya might want to arrange for a US citizenship for their son in the easiest possible way. Of course I haven’t proven anything, I am starting from the premise is it true, and evaluating granite’s case.

Granite1 says:

Re: ‘I blame Obama, not the birthers, for the turmoil, he could end it immediately, just release his BC.’

Answer: He has already published the birth certificate that Hawaii sent to him in 2007, the only birth certificate that Hawaii sends out to anyone. Hawaii has not sent out copies of the original long-form birth certificate since the short-form birth certificate became the official birth certificate in 2001.

Granite1 says:

Re: “the Governor of Hawaii says he can’t find the long form birth certificate.”

The governor of Hawaii did not say that he could not find the long form birth certificate. WND (and the Daily Mail too, apparently) have both speculated and said that he cannot find it. Abercrombie never said that he could not find it. In fact, he did not say that he looked or that he even looked into the files himself.

Not only did he NOT SAY it, but it is not true. The original birth certificate exists in the files and it has been found. It was found by TWO Republican officials in the first of their two confirmations. (The second said that the documents VERIFY that Obama was born in Hawaii). But, since WND is saying that the original may be missing, the key fact at this time is that the original is in the files.

Here are the actual words of the officials at the time:

Fukino said she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama’s original birth certificate.

“Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures,” Fukino said.

So not only did Abercrombie not say that the original is missing, it is not missing. And the official birth certificate plus the two confirmations show that Obama was born in Hawaii.

AND, much more importantly, there is not a shred of evidence that Obama was born anywhere other than Hawaii. His Kenyan grandmother never said that he was born in Kenya. She said repeatedly in the taped interview that he was born in Hawaii, where his father was studying at the time. AND she said in another interview that he first that her family in Kenya had heard of Obama’s birth was in a letter from Hawaii.

Granite1 says:

Re: “have to join Chris Matthews…again NOT a birther, not an Obama opponent, not a Republican (presumably)…I WANT TO SEE THAT BIRTH CERTIFICATE NOW.”

Answer: Chris Matthews is wrong about Hawaii law. He thinks that Hawaii can send out the original. He is wrong. Hawaii stopped sending out the original in 2001 when the short-form birth certificate became the official birth certificate. It may require a change in Hawaii law to start sending out the original again.

It would also take a significant change in Hawaii law for Hawaii to show original because birth certificates currently can only be sent to a limited list of the individual herself and family members. To make the original a public document certainly would require changing the law. But, the original is there, in the file. Abercrombie never said that it was missing.

Arne Jensen says:

On January 21st, 2009, his very first day in office, Barack Obama signed Executive Order 13489 banning the release of his birth certificate!

Interestingly, no link to “January 2009” at Whitehouse.gov http://whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/executive-orders

dabeeza says:

Fukino said she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama’s original birth certificate.
#81 read with me…

“Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures,” Fukino said.

They have personally seen the record (list of names)the DOH has with Obi’s name on it – same list Aberdufus saw before he gave his b’deep b’deep b’deep answer to the reporter. That makes three people who saw, or knew about a LIST with Obi’s name; no one has seen the BC, although I’ll grant you that some may have touched the LIST. You protest a bit too much…must be something there, I’m thinking.

gaetano says:

EXCUSE Me! Those of you Obama lovers that call people THE BIRTHERS better get one thing straight. IT was “Hillary”, thats right,:Hillary”, that started the birther calling,when she was running against him.Now, as far as I am concerned, Obama is hiding something, for a reason. That reason is what people want to know. They do know that when a person tries to cover themselves up, it is not lies that they hide, it is truths that they hide.So, If obama is hiding his birth certificate because it would prove his ineligibility, then a person could understand why he is hiding it. BUT,why all the other stuff like college records,etc. What good would that do unless they were all produced by fraud? Maybe, just maybe Obama never went to college,or maybe, he falsified his school loans under fraud ,or used s/s numbers that were fraud.What ever the reason he hides them,we the birthers or whatever you wish to call us, are smart enough to know, that it will be enough to hurt him politically, and thats enough for me, because I hate him. He has proven that he is a liar,thru and thru. He is a fake, and I know he does not believe in GOD.I don`t think he even believes in our American way of life.So, ok, now, go ahead and start on the racist bashing.If I like people of different colors or not,It is none of your business,and I don`t really care what you think.

Mr. Fusion says:

Alphie,

Six posts in a row. each as ignorant as the previous.

Get a life. Seek medical attention. Take your medication.

Granite1 says:

MikeN said: “Perhaps the father on the birth certificate is not as stated in the biography?”

Since the facts on the official birth certificate, the Certification of Live Birth, were taken from the facts on the long-form birth certificate in the files, the name of the father is the same on the original as it is on the official.

Re the lack of photos of the wedding not proving a wedding. The lack of photos from Kenya (and taking a trip to Kenya without taking photos is strange) is combined with the lack of official documents from Kenya and the lack of official travel documents from the USA.

Birthers claim that this is explained by the Kenyan government sealing and hiding Obama’s documents. But this explanation requires faith in the Kenyan government being so efficient that not only was it able to hide every document, but that it has successfully hidden the fact that it was even hiding documents. The latter seems quite a stretch given that divided governments tend to leak, and that complete efficiency in hiding files from such experts as the CIA (which surely would have investigated) plus foreign diplomats, plus journalists and freelance journalists seems extremely improbable.

In addition to the lack of Kenyan documents, there is the lack of US travel documents. For a child born in Africa to be admitted to the USA there has to be a US travel document for admission to the USA. That would be either a US visa on a foreign passport or the change to his mother’s passport to include him while she was in Kenya–and either document would be easy to find, and no such document has been found.

For Obama to have been born in any other country than the USA requires the combination of:

(1) Travel by his mother during late pregnancy (highly unlikely because of the high expense and high risk of such a trip in 1961. A round trip to Kenya for two has been estimated to have cost around $20,000 in 2010 terms, and there was high risk of stillbirth, and of Yellow Fever in Kenya [a Yellow Fever shot itself is risky during pregnancy]);

(2) Birth outside of Hawaii (also unlikely);

(3) Birth abroad despite the absence of any foreign documents or photographs showing either that Obama was born in a foreign country or that his mother was in the country at the time (highly unlikely);

(4) The willingness of the parents to lie about his place of birth (unlikely since it would be a crime to file a false government document, and the lie would be unnecessary since for most purposes naturalizing a foreign-born child would be just as good as his being born in the country);

(5) Successfully smuggling the child into the USA without a US travel document (extremely unlikely), and;

(6) Convincing the officials in Hawaii that he was born in Hawaii (also extremely unlikely).

ALL of these six things would be required for there to be a reasonable case that he was born in any other country than the USA. What are the odds of all six of them happening?

The willingness to believe that Obama was born outside of the USA despite the overwhelming odds against it and despite all the evidence that he was born in Hawaii is why Ann Coulter, Glenn Beck and Bill O’Reilly all call birthers crazy.

As for the absence of photos of the wedding not proving that there was a wedding. It is not constitutionally required that the parents of a president be married. You can vote against him in 2012 if you feel that he is illigitimate. However, to most people, an official copy of divorce documents tends to show that the people who were divorced were married at one time.

Granite1 says:

The long-form birth certificate, the original birth certificate, was found in the records by TWO Republican officials, who stated that they had seen the original BC in the files in Obama’s files

http://www.kitv.com/r/17860890/detail.html

The allegation that Obama’s published birth certificate, the official Certification of Live Birth, was checked out by the McCain campaign and found to be false. The attorney general of Hawaii was a CONSERVATIVE Republican for the last for years, and if he had thought that the BC was forged, he would have prosecuted–and he didn’t. And, in fact, only two guys who would not give their real names claimed that the published BC was forged

AND, it is the facts on the BC that are critical, and the officials in Hawaii–members of a Republican governor’s administration and the former Republican governor herself have repeatedly confirmed the facts on Obama’s BC, that he was born in Hawaii.

Granite1 says:

Re: “105Abercrombie never said that the original birth certificate cannot be found. and That begs the question, “why didn’t he find it.”

Answer: Your statement implies that he looked into the file and found something other than a birth certificate.

BUT Abercrombie did not say that there was not an original birth certificate in the file or that he found something other than the original birth certificate. Also, he did not say that he could not find what he was looking for.

It is merely speculation by WND that because Ambercrombie said, hastily, that there was a document in the files that this meant that there was not an original birth certificate in the files. Well, we cannot trust WND normally, and this kind of speculation is simply absurd.

Indeed, birthers have often said that they would not trust what Abercrombie said, but now that he may have said “document” or “record” and not “birth certificate” they trust that he looked (which we do not know) and that his words “document” or “record” does not mean a birth certificate.

This is just another example of why Ann Coulter, Bill O’Reilly and Glenn Beck all call birthers crazy.

In fact, there IS an original birth certificate in Obama’s file, and that is what Ambercrombie’s word “document” or “record’ or whatever referred to.

We KNOW that there is an original birth certificate in the file because of the first of two confirmations by the REPUBLICAN officials in Hawaii, in which they actually used the word “original birth certificate” (and in 1961 Hawaii did not allow a birth certificate from outside of Hawaii to be placed in a Hawaii birth file, or for that matter for a Hawaii birth file to be created for someone who was born outside of Hawaii).

As for the officials not “producing it,” well of course they couldn’t because Hawaii has not released the original long-form birth certificate to anyone since the short-form, the one that Obama showed, became the official birth certificate in 2001.

Granite1 says:

Birthers have also never explained how a child whom they claim was born in a foreign country could have been admitted into the USA without either a US visa or being entered on his mother’s US passport.

If either of those took place, then the application for such a document would be easy to find (particularly in Kenya, which is the main place where birthers claim Obama was born), but no such document has been found.

And Obama’s Kenyan grandmother NEVER said that he was born in Kenya. She said on the taped interview that he was born in Hawaii, where his father was studying, and she said in another interview that the first that her family in Kenya had heard of Obama’s birth was in a letter from Hawaii.

So there is no proof (except for obviously forged “Kenyan birth certificates”) that Obam was born in Kenya.

On the Hawaii side, in contrast, there is an official birth certificate and the confirmation of THREE Republican officials.

Notices of Obama’s birth appeared in the Hawaii newspapers about ten days after his birth. They were NOT advertisements. Hawaii newspapers did not accept birth announcements in those days. They only published the notices sent to them by the department of vital records. That department only sent out notices for births IN Hawaii.

And, Hawaii did not allow “walk in” registrations. It insisted on proof when there was a claim that the child was born outside of a hospital. Proof in the form of a witness statement, such as from the doctor or midwife.