Part One
Part Two
Part Three
A lot of interesting memes and accusations within this press conference. Daniel Ellsberg shows up in part one with some chilling information about Obama.
This self serving ass should be in prison or dead. He has shown his true colors with this last release leaving in the names of informants so that they can be targeted and killed for helping to take their country back from nut case radicals
he is a self serving egotist who simply wants to be famous no matter what the cost or who it hurts
“he is a self serving egotist who simply wants to be famous no matter what the cost or who it hurts”
A statement that also applies to nearly every person to occupy the oval office or congress for the past 100 years. Probably longer.
Who are you talking about?? The Wikileaks guy? The lawyer? Ellsberg? Who? None of this would have happened if Obama stuck to his promise to get us out of Iraq immediately. “You can take that to the bank.”
Meanwhile, the vile commenting public really let’s the Wikileaks guy have it on MSNBC’s site (of all places). Wild and amazing know-nothing threats and innuendo. For all we know the “names revealed” are all bogus. In fact I wonder about this entire charade. One of my readers says this whole thing is suppressed in China. Why? That in itself is odd.
#. Or if we had an open press that was able/willing/allowed to cover the wars. Keeping us in the dark and feeding us shit is not my idea of freedom.
I think its interesting that so many will condemn the leaker, I personally think whistleblowers should be encouraged.
Its one of those “hey, hey hey! you dont support OUR TROOPS! You’re not a patriot!” etc, if we ever mention the crazy, awful shit going on “in the name of freedom”.
I would personally prefer if normal peoples names could have been scrambled, but military staff and those who commit atrocities should be held responsible.
The fact is, the mainstream media and those “running this war” are telling us sweet FA, thank you to Wikileaks for letting us know, in raw data, what has happened in this unjust war.
I would suspect the names to be fake.
Traditionally the identity of an intelligence asset is only known by the spies who recruited him/her and not documented.
I don’t know how modern military intelligence compares with cold war era spy games, but it does seem like common sense to use aliases.
Organisational leaks are pretty common after all.
This is necessary at a time when the corporate media has failed (and ‘bloggers’ have little expertise or resources).
P.S. If they have revealed informants that is immoral.
I am talking about the wiki leaks guy. I don’t care if the names were faked, he did not know that and still released it ( this has been confirmed by those who worked with him) In this world there need to be some secrets , they keep us safe
If all you here claiming about being all open why don’t you open up all your closets and let the skeletons out and see how you like it and if all that honesty helps you or hurts you
#3
“None of this would have happened if Obama stuck to his promise to get us out of Iraq immediately. “You can take that to the bank.”
This still would have happened. Whether he kept us in or gotten us out. It was bound to get told sometime. Just like how the US treated the German and Japanese Americans during WWII.
You cannot suppress these kinds of stories forever. It should have happened sooner but now is as good as time as any.
This kind of stuff routinely goes on in wars. Just like some acts of kindness and valour will be reported after the fact as well. I can tell you a dozen stories from WWII vets I knew that had similar tales of horror and heroism.
War isn’t called hell without reason. C’mon, you’re old enough to know that.
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#8
“In this world there need to be some secrets , they keep us safe”
Secrets do not keep people safe.
There is no REAL safety in this world. That is an illusion we try and convince ourselves of so we don’t go nuts. This is a perilous world.
Some of us out here would LIKE to know the dangers so we can form contingency plans for what might come. Honesty will ALWAYS be the best policy because it holds the most profit.
Eventually your secrets get told, your hiding gets revealed and if you are still alive when it happens all so-called profit from those tactics will be made worthless or removed from you.
Hence to make profit and KEEP it. Be honest and treat others as you would want to be treated.
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As a United States Military Veteran.. I am appalled at the revelations of murder, torture and total disregard for the Geneva Convention.. What the hell has happened to this country which I grew believing was the “Good Guy”, that stood for Human Rights and Justice for all..???
We are supposed to be above this shit, but instead we have stooped to the level of the lowlife terrorist themselves.. And we have signaled to all of enemies that torture and murder of our own civilians and soldiers is fair game.. How do we claim to be right and take the high ground when we have acted exactly like our enemies ???
Im going to ask ALL of you a question.
ARE YOU responsible for your Government?
Are you responsible for WHAT/HOW your government works/does/is.
In the USA, we are SUPPOSED to be responsible.
What has happened?
#11 – EXACTLY. That’s why these “leaks” are necessary. It’s part of being an informed citizenry. We need to know what our government is doing.
Time to hand over those responsible from the Cheney administration.
#11 mike m “As a United States Military Veteran.. I am appalled at the revelations of murder, torture and total disregard for the Geneva Convention..”
Where ya been Mike? This stuff is as old a history.
Ever hear of Andersonville, or Camp Sumter?
How about My Lai?
Maybe air raids over civilian populations in Europe and over Japan during WWII?
How about some more from good old Vietnam?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_Force
the routine torture and execution of prisoners
the routine practice of intentionally killing unarmed Vietnamese villagers including men, women, children, and elderly people
the routine practice of cutting off and collecting the ears of victims
the practice of wearing necklaces composed of human ears
the practice of cutting off and collecting the scalps of victims
an incident where a young mother was drugged, raped, and then executed
an incident where a soldier killed a baby and cut off his or her head after the baby’s mother was killed
Another thing that amazes me and troubles me about this whole thing.. Is the way it is being reported.. Most of the reports I am hearing are condenming the leaks or reporting on how this could hurt the troops or jeopardize the intelligence community or the Iraqis who worked for the Americans.. But I do not hear anyone talking about the war crimes that were committed and who is responsible for this violation of the Geneva Convention…?? Is that not the Real Story here ????
#15 Old History ??? Does that make it OK?? Are you defending torture ??
Would it be OK for someone in your family to be tortured????
Geneva Convention started in 1949.. The officers at the My Lai Massacre were tried in a court..
And then there was Nuremberg after WW2..
I guess this isn’t really a war just some kind of political action or something like that.
I mean if it was a real war wouldn’t we nuke them from outer space or something like that? Like we did to the Japanese? Or fire bomb the Middle East like we did with Germany?
If it isn’t a real war which I suspect it is the truth. We shoul walk away and let them kill each other.
I have no problem with that.
OK, the US and it’s “coalition of the willing” have been at it more than twice as long as WW2. If it is a “good war” then this will make no difference.
Afganistan and Iraq (yea, like the US is done there) will do for Obama what Vietnam did for LBJ.
#3 Um John if we had left Iraq on day one what does that have to do with Afghanistan? The leaked material is about Afghanistan.
I thought our reasons for going to Afghanistan were rather clear cut at the time. Something to do with a couple of buildings that fell down as I recall.
Just asking.
#17 “Old History ??? Does that make it OK?? Are you defending torture ??”
Of course I am not defending torture. Just pointing out that and other atrocities have been around a long time and probably will be around in the future.
War is a nasty business and there is no getting around that.
I just don’t understand the role of Wikileaks. I feel they do as much harm is good. Do you really think they are going to change anything?
I personally feel that Assange is just an ego driven ass drawing attention to himself.
#mextli — I think I have one interesting theory about what’s up with Wikileaks on tomorrow’s Noagenda.
#9 if we left right after the election this might have happened, but only to end up in a book without everyone wringing their hands and calling for the guy’s lynching and on and on… This is a circus that would not be in play.
Obama is a weak president for allowing repeated leaks like this. Lincoln, FDR, would not have stood for this, so he can forget about that level. But for Obama it’s worse. Even Clinton would have prevented this, and he wasn’t fighting many real wars.
Mextil said
I just don’t understand the role of Wikileaks. I feel they do as much harm is good. Do you really think they are going to change anything?
I personally feel that Assange is just an ego driven ass drawing attention to himself.
They have stated their role.. It is to expose the truth.. If the truth is that the US committed War Crimes.. then I want to know that.. and I think anyone who gives a flying crap about this country would also want to know what is being done in our name with our tax dollars…
And Yes I definatley think something can be done about it..And no I do not think it is OK to blow it off, by saying.. Ah well war is messy.. or man this stuff is been going on for a long time..
I was a US Army Soldier.. And the Geneva Convention is sacred to the the Military and needs to be followed and upheld as it protects all in war time situations.
Dead man walking.lol
Yep, there are two kinds of people: Those who value the truth, and those that want to keep secrets.
Then there are those who know that there are pro’s and con’s to everything we do, like having an open truthful transparent government or keeping secrets.
The harm caused by keeping secrets is ALWAYS many times worse than the harm caused by transparency. Ironic that in most cases, the actual harm caused by transparency is that the government can’t keep any more secrets==hah, hah.
Hypothetically: what is the very worst harm ever resulting from the truth? couple of dozen secret agents lost?–what? Meanwhile the harm by keeping secrets is covert wars undermining entire countries and civil war/wars going on for years. Which is really worse?
Sorry jack booted thugs, your secret superman underwear is on display, and you look foolish.
What about secrets that do need to be kept?
Probably the best one is the Manhattan Project?
Ha, ha.
No secret at all except from the American people. Papa Joe had the inside scoop from day one. Would it have mattered if the Japanese or the Germans knew we were working on it? Hardly as everyone was.
Secrets==more dogma for the brainless right to lap up and have them keep voting against their own self interests.
Silly Hoomans.
I believe that you would have to be delusional to think we will return to the limited federal government created by the US Constitution without first falling into civil and economic collapse.
The US Constitution was designed to protect from Govt the smallest minority group possible, the minority of one, the individual. It did so by saying NO! to a broad range of possible Gov’t excesses. But it is just a piece of paper. Fed Govt first ignored it, now they hold it in open contempt.
Today, our Fed Gov’t regulates each of us to such an extreme and has been doing so for generations to the point that most US citizens have no idea what it would be like to enjoy the individual freedoms that the US Constitution was designed to protect. As I have expressed in frustration to my representatives, you literally cannot take a crap in your own home without being subject to Gov’t control in the form of regulated design of your toilet.
There are precious few politicians in Wash that work to turn back Fed Govt, Sen DeMint comes quickly to mind. And he has done exemplary work in that regard.
But you are kidding yourself if you think the election coming up will matter a whit in changing the direction of the Fed Govt. We have been enslaved, long ago forfeited our freedoms, and a great many citizens were applauding while their rights were being trampled. Repub or Dem, both are guilty.
I would rather live in squalor than to lose individual rights. But too many citizens saw how hard life could be and begged Govt for reddress. And Govt was all too happy to throw them a few crumbs in exchange for expanding their scope and power.
We The People were supposed to control our Govt. Anybody believe that the people control the Fed Govt today rather than the other way around?
checkthis,
in your little simpleton fantasy world, mommy and daddy provide everything for you to suckle, magically.
In the real world, complicated disagreements and exchanges happen that work our common rules and processes. These exchanges are based on existing principals, like English Common Law and French Common Law (in LA), and take hundreds of years of debate to develop and resolve. Without rules and law, we would be living in shit, literally, as in Cholera infested, trash mound living. You would be dead from illness by age 25.
Retards think this kind of Progress happens in an evening of discussion.
aND back TO MY QUESTION i POSTED..
#12
Im going to ask ALL of you a question.
ARE YOU responsible for your Government?
Are you responsible for WHAT/HOW your government works/does/is.
In the USA, we are SUPPOSED to be responsible.
What has happened?
========================
LIVE in a REAL WORLD..
KNOW whats going on.
WHY it is happening..
DECIDE if its what you want to happen.
The only people Your congress and reps hear from is the CORPS…
Its time for YOU to BITCH to someone who is SUPPOSED to care for your thoughts/comments.
IF they DONT, get them IMPEACHED..