A judge has denied a request for President Barack Obama to testify at a court martial for a U.S. Army flight surgeon who refused to deploy to Afghanistan until he saw proof that Obama was born in the United States.
The judge, Army Col. Denise Lind, said any evidence or witnesses related to Obama’s citizenship is irrelevant to the charges against Lt. Col. Terrence Lakin, who has 17 years of service in the U.S. military…
In addition to putting Obama on their witness list, Lakin’s lawyers had asked Lind to order Obama’s official birth records from Hawaii be brought to court for trial…
The judge ruled that the matter of Obama’s eligibility is not relevant because he did not give any orders in the case. She pointed out that while the president is commander-in-chief of the military, it is Congress that is constitutionally empowered to raise armies, pay them and equip them…
Lind also said that military law says that a soldier’s personal beliefs or convictions are not sufficient to allow that soldier to determine that an order is illegal. The soldier has to have “no rational doubt” that the order is illegal before he or she can ignore it.
Finally she ruled that a military court martial is not the forum in which to determine a president’s eligibility, because the Constitution says only Congress has the power to impeach and remove the president.
Another sect where ideology overwhelms material reality.
My birth certificate was necessary to obtain a US Passport. I needed one for my son when he turned 18. I had an “Abstract of Live Birth” document from San Francisco, but the State Department would not accept it as proof of US Citizenship. Imagine that. I had to go and obtain a certified copy of the actual Birth Certificate.
I guess if he was a running for President of the United States the abstract would have been adequate.
I have birth certs for both myself and my son, and we both have US Passports. I guess this makes us ineligible for Obamacare, and not desirable Democrats.
No worse defense than selected not elected. 6 of one, half dozen of the other.
#26
No worries. Arizona is like Mississippi without the humidity.
#5 Animby
Wow. I just love how the rabid right throws out the idea that Obama’s birth certificate lists his religion as muslim, and that is why it is being “suppressed”.
Ummm…. this is the US. Not the middle East or SE Asia. We don’t list religion on birth certificates, passports, drivers license, etc. like the 3rd world does. In the US, your religion is between you and your faith. We don’t care.
So to answer your question, his birth certificate does NOT list muslim, nor does it list any religion at all. Mine doesn’t, and he is only 2 years older than me.
Eidhard, this really is a bullshit posting by you. So some wackjob guy in the army decides he does not want to be a soldier. He decides to pull some kind of stunt. So what?
This does not lessen anyone’s distrust of the sock monkey, despite your leftist dreams.
#5: “I believe he was born in Hawaii. I suspect the thing he’s hiding is that his BC list his religion as Muslim.”
I just checked my birth certificate, and my wife and children’s certificates from several cities and states (we moved around a bit). There’s no place on any of those certificates that declares the religion of the child. Religion’s determined by the parents, or the person at a later time, not the local government.
Give Eideard a break. He got a discussion going didn’t he?
Otherwise, isn’t their news out there somewhere about a bird dropping that looks like Muhammad?
Faxon, don’t listen to Eideard. You will believe and say whatever I tell you. And you’ll pay good money for the privilege too.
I find it odd that the only birth certificate a 49 year old man can cough up is one that was printed off in 2007.
I am also a member of the 1961 population cohort, just as Obama, and for as long as I can remember I’ve had to produce an original birth certificate on the odd occasion, and the one I use in a contemporary 1961-issue certificate. When I got a passport in the 1980s, I needed it. When I got my drivers license in the 1970s, I needed it. When I lost my Social Security card in the 90s, I needed it. I think my parents needed it back in 68 to get my SSN.
Obama is no backwoods country hick that is new to driving, or international travel. So, what the hell has he been using as a birth certificate for the prior 46 years before 2007?
I think Barry is a citizen, and at least the contemporary birth announcement in the Hawaiian newspaper lends some credence to that, but why no “old” certificate?
Those devious bastards!
#39 Alfred Persson
“Authentic live birth cert., which begs the question, as one could have been obtained, after giving birth in Kenya.
No one checked to see if the child was actually born in the USA.”
…the problem is that being born in the USA is completely irrelevant, what matters is being “a natural born Citizen”, and your actual place of birth is not a factor for determining this. You can be born on Sedna and still be eligible.
Where are the Republican opponents who would do anything to tear him down to win an election….oh that’s right even McCain said this was BS.
Seems like the RNC, the McCain campaign, and the Clinton campaign would have jumped at the chance to invalidate his candidacy, if there was any truth to this.
Angle brackets Alfred Persson. This ain’t no hokey markup bs, but the real thing.
If you knew how to do basic HTML then you’d know that Barack Obama is actually a godless Korean communist who’s DNA has been adjusted to make him look black after they bred him in an axolotl tank from the stolen cells of Richard Nixon taken during his 1972 China visit.
But Alfred…don’t you love Jesus?
Well that troll worked. ?8^)
“Another sect where ideology overwhelms material reality.”
In the context in which this sentence is given a person must know you rather well in order to be sure about the group to which you refer when you use the word sect.
Re: “Completely ignores the material reality that Obama has used every legal means to prevent public access to his birth certificate.”
Answer: That is false. Obama has already posted the OFFICIAL birth certificate of Hawaii, and the facts on it were confirmed twice by the officials of the Department of Health and Department of Vital Records of Hawaii, and by the governor of Hawaii.
Hawaii does not now and did not in 1961 allow a birth document of any kind to be issued that indicated birth in Hawaii unless there was proof that the child was born in Hawaii. Obama’s published birth certificate says on it that he was born in Hawaii, and that is the fact that the officials have repeatedly confirmed.
Re: “every legal means to prevent public access to his birth certificate.”
Answer: That is a myth because THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A LAWSUIT AGAINST OBAMA FOR HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE OR FOR DOCUMENTS. Virtually all the lawsuits were to stop the election. Then there were lawsuits to stop the Electoral College from voting and the Congress from certifying the election and to stop the Inauguration. There never was a lawsuit just for the birth certificate or just for documents. In our system you have to defend against all lawsuits, no matter how stupid.
Re: The notices in the newspapers were generated by the filing of government documents.
Answer; That is true. But in Hawaii in 1961, those documents would only be filed for a birth IN HAWAII. At the time Hawaii did not allow a birth that had occurred outside of Hawaii to be registered at all. Not AT ALL.
In the first of the two confirmations, the officials said that there is an official birth certificate in Obama’s file. Since no foreign (not even another state’s) birth certificate could be filed, the original must be a Hawaiian birth certificate. In the second of two confirmations, the officials said that the document in the files VERIFIES that Obama was born in Hawaii. In addition to the verification by the officials, there is this witness, who recalls being told of Obama’s birth in Hawaii in 1961.
Also, Obama’s kenyan grandmother never said that he was born in Kenya. She said repeatedly in the taped interview that he was born in Hawaii, and she said in another interview that the first that her family in Kenya had heard of Obama’s birth was in a letter from Hawaii.
Re: “Authentic live birth cert., which begs the question, as one could have been obtained, after giving birth in Kenya.”
Answer. That is not possible. In 1961, Hawaii did not allow foreign birth certificates or even birth certificates from other states to be filed. So, the birth certificate in the files CANNOT be from another country.
And it did not then and does not now allow a birth document of any kind to be issued that said “born in Hawaii” on it, unless there was proof that the child was born in Hawaii. Obama’s says on it “born in Hawaii,” and that is the fact that the officials in Hawaii have confirmed twice and most recently the governor of Hawaii did too.
By the way, Obama’s Kenyan grandmother never said that he was born in Kenya. She said repeatedly in the taped interview that he was born in Hawaii. (Most birther sites cut off the tape just before she is asked the question “Where was he born?” to which she replies Hawaii several times.) And, she said in another interview that the first that her family in Kenya had heard of Obama’s birth was in a letter from Hawaii.
Re: “…the anouncements are generated by receiving the cert. of live birth, which does not require proof the child was born in the USA.’
Answer. At the time that Obama was born Hawaii did not allow a foreign birth certificate to be filed AT ALL. So the document that generated the announcement cannot have been a foreign birth certificate. Only a birth certificate issued in Hawaii could generate the announcement.
IN addition, we know that the document in the files says on it that Obama was born in Hawaii because the officials in Hawaii in their second confirmation said that the original VERIFIES that Obama was born in Hawaii.
Do we have to continue with this crap?
Every “birther” is a RACIST!! Plain and simple, end of story. Obama is an American, there is overwhelming proof online, and anyone who fails to believe it is purposely being ignorant and irrational.
Racism is also based on ignorance and irrationality, so already they are in the same neighborhood. But then when you add in stuff about him being a secret African Muslim, etc. It all adds up to a “Newspeak”: Questioning Obama’s origins = Obama is Black!
Racism is alive and well, especially in the GOP. The “birther” movement pulled the covers off and revealed the facts.
Re: “and for as long as I can remember I’ve had to produce an original birth certificate on the odd occasion, and the one I use in a contemporary 1961-issue certificate. When I got a passport in the 1980s, I needed it. When I got my drivers license in the 1970s, I needed it. When I lost my Social Security card in the 90s, I needed it. I think my parents needed it back in 68 to get my SSN. ”
Answer: The Certification of Live Birth is the OFFICIAL birth certificate, and it is used by thousands of people every year to get all the things that you mention.
Moreover, the so called ‘birther bill,” the draft legislation sponsored by about seven Republicans that calls for future candidates to prove their birth in the USA, calls for the OFFICIAL birth certificate, not the original one.
I asked it earlier but I’ll ask it again: Where’s George W Bush’s birth certificate? Where’s Bill Clinton’s? Where’s any other president’s?
I want proof that any president ever has even been born at all.
As far as needing your birth certificate, the only birth certificate I’ve ever had is a orange/yellow piece of paper with “birth certificate” on it, my birth info typed into the blanks on the form, a stamp from the county clerk and a seal from a notary. It could be forged in about 10 minutes. It looks a lot more unofficial than Obama’s and it has gotten me a driver’s license and passport.
Birthers are retards. So are 9/11 truthers. Hi, Adam!
So maybe his birth certificate doesn’t list his religion, maybe it lists someone else as his father?
Of perhaps Obama was just trying to distract people with a fake story, like Bush with the cocaine or National Guard?
Re: “So maybe his birth certificate doesn’t list his religion, maybe it lists someone else as his father?”
Obama has already shown his birth certificate, the Certification of Live Birth, which is the official birth certificate of Hawaii, used every year by thousands of people.
Maybe you are referring to the original birth certificate, which has not been sent out by Hawaii since 2001, even to people born before 2001. That document does not have a place to list religion. And, since the Certification was created when a clerk looked into the file, read the original document and entered the facts onto a form, the Certification must say the same thing as the original about the father. It was Obama senior.
Re: “they seem to be the only ones wondering why President O works so hard to keep information proving his nationality, secret.”
Answer. He hasn’t. He was the first and only US president to post his birth certificate. The facts on the birth certificate were confirmed repeatedly by the officials in Hawaii, most recently by the republican governor of Hawaii. There was never a lawsuit against Obama for his birth certificate or for documents. Virtually all the lawsuits were to stop the election, stop the Electoral College, stop the Inauguration. In our country you have to defend against every lawsuit, no matter how stupid.
On a sidenote to show what kind of people are leading these idiots:
http://amplifyyourvoice.org/u/AFY_EmilyB/2010/9/4/Tea-Party-president-jokes-about-murdering-GLBTQ-people
Anyone who talks about a person’s identity instead of their actiohns is an idiot, anyway. The birthers push this crap against the President (which would have NEVER flown during Bush the lesser’s administration) and the GOP not-so-subtly supports it because any real debate would have to include a discussion of the President’s policies. That would have to involve those fact thingies that the Right can’t handle very well. Hence, this disingenuous bullsh*t attacking the person instead of their actions.
This is ridiculous. US military officers can resign, any time they choose. And probably still manage to get some portion of a pension. Just as Oliver North was allowed to, in spite of his conviction. I knew a 2nd Lt. in the Air Force, a “90 day wonder” as they called them. Who resigned a few years after being assigned as our squadron Safety Office. Because he told us how “tied” his hands were at accomplishing anything meaningful. Just a dead end position and career. So he quit. I had to stick it out for two more years, no choice! I always thought it was weird how they services spend more money training officers, who are allowed to resign at any time. But the enlisted grunts are stuck with serving their four or six year contracts. That’s because the enlisted do all the actual work. And most of the dying too. So the services can’t afford to allow them to quit. Every new war, they’d flee in droves. I doubt that they’ve made service mandatory for junior officers since the Korean War.