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#3, bobbo,
Speaking of across the board drug legalization. I see as highly questionable the state legalizing addictive substances for the sole purposes of them being a source of tax revenue. I’m fine with the substances being legal to use, but I’m not so fine with the state treating drug addicts as an endless source of income, who they know will continue using even as it jacks of the rate of the tax. Exploiting highly inelastic demand for a product to fill the public coffers is something I cannot support.
#62–Sea Lawyer==you are being foolish. Imagine you live in a meaningless universe and that in reality nothing means anything. No morality in taxes. No morality in drugs. Imagine a universe where the only operating principle is PRAGMATISM.
From that viewpoint, the only issue regarding taxation is how much can an item be taxed before the revenue therefrom will be undercut by enforcement costs or the black market?
I feel silly asking this, but what is the exact violation you feel when people are free to pay a tax or not based on buying a substance they don’t need at all? I can’t think of anything else that shouldn’t be taxed to the max === pragmatically.
Are you confusing recreational drugs with medicinal drugs? All the same arguments, but we are not pragmatic creatures. We should still pick and choose where we allow our emotions to run wild?
#63, okay, so you tax a heroin addict at a rate of 500% because you know me will pay it, and I’ll tax a a cancer patient 500% for his drugs because I know he will too. Since pragmatically, one person is of minuscule value compared to the whole of society, it’s more important that we bring in revenues to better society, even if it comes through exploitation of an individual’s “need.”
S/L==go back and read what I posted one more time. Being pragmatic = the value is in raising taxes from people who VOLUNTARILY pay FOR SOMETHING THEY DON’T NEED.
From the emotional side = sick people have no voluntary choice and they need the drugs.
Seems to me you missed the whole point. Sea Lawyer, will you ever get your legs?
It’s all fun and games until you find out everyone who’s building your airplanes are stoned. I used to build aircraft parts, and of course we couldn’t work if we were on certain medications…so how in the hell do you find out who’s stoned while working? There is currently no way to find out if you’ve lit up in the past 12 hours, so until we come up with a breathalizer for weed, it should be a no go.
At least alcohol leaves an overwhelming stench on the user that alerts everyone around them. If I can’t build your aircraft while on Viacdin, I surely don’t want other building them stoned…Think folks!!!
ThatsyourChin==wholly crap!!! I never thought of THAT. Let me think about that conundrum for a while, will ya?
Ok. You are right. We should outlaw airplane parts making as well. It only makes sense.
#65, are you so sure that once a person reaches the state of dependency on a substance, that they are voluntarily doing anything? That is a very naive position on your part.
Judging what is a need is highly subjective. Why is it a need that people be given drugs to extend their lives beyond what they would naturally be otherwise?
An overweight sloth who “needs” medication for his lifestyle induced diabetes merits no more consideration than a heroin addict who “needs” his fix to keep from getting sick. And if we are going to exploit those needs because the state wants its tax revenue, then they should both be exploited the same.
S/L==you ever go back woods camping? How long will you go down a trail before you realize it is the wrong fork and admit it, having to backtrack to get on the right trail?
The default is still and always PRAGMATISM. Sick or fat, need or no need, how much you can tax before the revenue is undercut by cost of enforcement or the black market. Sprinkle on the emotions as fits your fancy.
Seems ironclad to me. What are you drinking by the way? I could join you.
#69, Because my own morality doesn’t support the state exploiting chemically addicted people just for the sake of raising revenues. The logical next step is for the state to actively encourage the use of these substances, to provide even more money to the coffers. Or using your criteria: how many people can we encourage and get to use before the cost of dealing with the ill effects is greater than the revenue we can collect from them?
You yourself say that we don’t live in a fantasy universe void of emotions, and yet you want to selectively restrict the set of valid positions to one where it does. So am I free to sprinkle on the emotion only in the instances where they are in alignment with yours? Shall we talk about your preference for universal healthcare? Is it only because of your belief that economically, having a single provider of care is undisputedly the most efficient system, or is it because of how wrong you think it is that people who cannot afford to pay for their own care are left on the side of the street to die?
I’m starting to ramble. It must be late, and this Fiji water is getting to me đ
S/L–if its economically cheaper to provide care for all, doesn’t it make any interest in social justice irrelevant?
Who in their right mind, ie NOT LIEberTARDS, wants to pay MORE for a service in the name of Freedom?
but most choices are false. I say there is an economic and a humanitarian reason to provide universal healthcare. The humanitarian impulse must be moderated by what is possible to do. That is why right up front I want to deal with rationing healthcare==no heart transplants for those over 100 years old in the ICU for one example. Of course, being I am an ethical eugenicist, my list is a bit longer.
Is it finally clear now you are only arguing with yourself. I didn’t know fresh water could have that effect on normal people.
#63..
i CAN..
As a person azlone on a Planet…NOTHING.
AS a perons in a SMAL TOWN, tey charge us for Irrigation..99.9% of the \people DONT IRRIGATE,,,,
so figure that out..
———————————————
64, DITTO//
until corps xo it PROPERLY..
====================================
69,..
WOW, you understand the idiocy
=====================================
70
Can I ask…
That IF” I could PROVE that MOST(at least 20%) of those you invested in,…WERE DRUNK?? HIGH?? BOMBED??
=====================================
=============================================
65, GOOD POINT…
NOW..
Why didnt the health bill pass?
I have a word foir it, and it REQUIRES a 12 gauge.
=============================================
#16
Statement:
YOU HAVE A PERSONAL RIGHT, to do anything you wish to/with YOURSELF AND/OR another consenting ADULT.
This all goes down the plumbing when you consider all that you do affects others in one way or another. People are not solitary islands. Even thought hold consequences to other people besides your self-absorbed selves.
You use any drugs for recreation and the following issues arise:
Drugs impair your mental and physical functions.
Drugs cause dependency over time
This impairment and dependency affects you, your work, your family and the system
of health care you will eventually turn to when they ravage your body
I for one do NOT want your filthy, drugged up ass on the road, in my place of work, in my trauma center and on my welfare system because you can’t keep control of your
dopamine over-stimulated monkey brain.
It is bad enough we have you drug addicts choking society with your booze, cigarettes and caffeine. Now you all want to add every other drug on the planet and more they will HAVE to come up with just to keep you stoned when your dopamine receptors learn to tolerate and not respond to the drugs you give them now.
On another note about this thread. Taxes are NOT bad. They do a lot of things we need as a Republic. What is BAD is when taxation is abused by politicians. Again this is a clear confusion of a THING being bad, which they never are. It is their misused application.
DRUGS are not a bad thing. It is how humans use it as a toy that is the bad thing. Drug good, misuse bad. Taxes good, misuse bad. Religion good, misuse bad. Get it? Hell even water can be misused.
We need taxes. We cannot maintain a decent society without them. We would not have roads, schools, post offices, bridges, hydro-electric systems, water works, etc. without them. We just have to get off our jaded, TV watching, drug playing asses and take the reigns back from the politicians and be their boss. It is really hard to be a good boss and make progress if you are too interested in watching TV, drinking beer and being a generally lazy ass idiot.
I don’t believe everyone wants to build their own private roads to get to and from work everyday. Nor have to draw and test your own water. Nor have to build your own power grid. Nor do we want corporations to provide it all without some form of regulation. As we see how the housing market and the banks turned out when we let the fox guard the hen house.
All of that is paid by your taxes. And that is a monumental good thing.
Cursor_
Funny that the video is 4:20.
#33 makes a good point… what about the “legal” aspect as to selling it?? every time some dickweed gets in trouble he is going to blame weed and the weed ppl get their azz’s sued off… lets just face it… we are a dysfunction country that can’t find it’s azz even with using both hands.
faustus can’t find his azz = speak for yourself. Mike and you are wrong. There is no significant issue with black market cigarettes. Mexico is not collapsing from within because of roll your own cigs.
Total lack of balance.
The fact is that the “war on drugs” is a miserable failure and it always will be. Anyone on the front lines of this “war” will confirm this. However, they love the employment and the military “toys” it gets them. They bust a stoner, but him in jail, where he learns how to be a REAL criminal, then go out and take their ‘roids to give them an “edge”. They laugh about it.
It is insanity to keep doing the same thing over and over expecting different results – thus, the war on drugs is insanity.
Marijuana can be used safely and effectively. It is certainly better than alcohol in many ways since violence while stoned is unheard of. There are drugs like meth and PCP that are a serious health problem, but not marijuana.
Marijuana enhances reality, alleviates pain, heightens awareness and makes life better. Music is awesome, food tastes like manna from heaven and sex is downright spiritual.
Legalization has worked incredibly well everywhere it has been done around the world, reducing abuse and eliminating the criminal element. Let’s try sanity, eh?
Cursor/
“We need taxes. We cannot maintain a decent society without them. We would not have roads, schools, post offices, bridges, hydro-electric systems, water works, etc. without them. We just have to get off our jaded, TV watching, drug playing asses and take the reigns back from the politicians and be their boss. It is really hard to be a good boss and make progress if you are too interested in watching TV, drinking beer and being a generally lazy ass idiot.”
Good points, and well said.
Can I ask?
The STANDARD DYNAMIC of economics goes like THIS..
The amount of money claimed by Taxes PAYS for certain things. It PAID for them in the past, WHY NOT NOW?
#1 WAGES..Everyones went UP except YOURS..
#2 Boss get more, CHARGES MORE, and YOU PAY MORE
#3 the Value of the medium USED went up in COST so we charge MORE for it.
#4 congress/reps got a RAISE and forGOT about you/me/everyone else.
So, lets deal with 3,4..
The value of creosote and TAR, DID THEY GO UP?
Did your STATE and FEDERAL representatives get RAISES?
The first sentence about summed it up. The rest was redundant. Legalize it and regulate it like alcohol and tobacco. Take the money away from the drug dealers and make law enforcement much easier.
The Dems will tax it. They will tax anything and everything they can think of then write loop holes for Congress critters.
79,
Lets look at the saving, JUST with MJ..
It costs OVER $40k per year to place a person in jail.
about 60% of those in Jail are in for MINOR drug charges 3-5 years.
Low number of 100,000×40,000=$40,000,000,000? for 1 year?
There have been taxes as long as people have lived in groups of more than two or three. In other words, as long as there have been people. How many thousands of years?
If you seriously believe people can live without taxes, ever, anywhere, you’re dreaming!
nice who ever typed in the text, misspelled engage or as they typed it, ingage… LOLz quality post there DVU!!!
Message to Bobbo. Shut the fuck up you left-wing Maggot! Fucking left-wing Democrats like you is why marijuana is illegal. Besides dipshit, it was Pete Wilson and a Republican controlled assembly that signed into medicinal marijuana. Nine of 13 states had Republican Governors sign medicinal use into law. It’s very simple. Republicans still believe in State’s rights whereas Democrats, like the little Marxsts that they are belive in Federal Law trumping State Law. Get a clue you Spasmo!
I voted YES on 19, I cannot wait to live in a state where I am no longer afraid to use my herb as medicine and recreational enjoyment without being afraid of beinn thrown into jail!