From CollateralMurder.com:
WikiLeaks has released a classified US military video depicting the indiscriminate slaying of over a dozen people in the Iraqi suburb of New Baghdad — including two Reuters news staff.
Reuters has been trying to obtain the video through the Freedom of Information Act, without success since the time of the attack. The video, shot from an Apache helicopter gun-site, clearly shows the unprovoked slaying of a wounded Reuters employee and his rescuers. Two young children involved in the rescue were also seriously wounded.
Look at the truth behind the story.
The ‘provocation’ for the shooting of these civilians was that there were two reporters talking to them, and a small group of people gathered around. One of the reporters was supposedly carrying the RPG launcher, BUT actually it was a camera with a 70-200 F/2.8 zoom lens, the standard lens for a journalist in that sort of environment. There was one AK-47 found on scene, but it was not illegal to have it, and the event happened during the peak of the secterian violence, when Iraquis were more afraid of other Iraquis than of the Americans, and having someone armed in a group was almost a requirement.
The American soldiers were just acting as bloodthirsty “we need to shoot something” aholes… the opportunity came up and they went for it, laughing all the way through it. The way that the gunner is just begging for a chance to reshoot the crawling guy, asking him to reach for ANY weapon (when there were NO American troops anywhere near the vecinity) tells you just how bloodthirsty and dishonorably the American ‘soldiers’ actually behaved.
There was a war crime committed in the video, and we need to hold those involved accountable.
The video came to us via Wikileaks.org, and was probably provided to them by an honorable American military Officer that was disgusted by what he saw and the ‘official’ lies that followed to cover it up.
It is overwhelmingly sad that we have become so uncaring that when another announcement that “47 civilians were killed in an accidental bombing by US forces” we just shrug (and the truly sick justify and cheer), yet we do not demand a single drop of accountability.
Thank you for posting the video Cherman, if you did it out of disgust, you have gained new found respect.
Another proud moment in the JUST and NECESSARY fight for Iraqi oil.
Just think, in a few years it will be Chinese helicopters picking off “insurgents” in American cities. You never know.
As a vet and not a bleeding heart liberal…I am disgusted.
Since when is it OK to kill people picking up wounded?
#14: Since you’re being obtuse:
We should be fighting under the same ROE as law enforcement in this country. If the gun is aimed directly at somebody, sure, open fire. But this video clearly shows that wasn’t the case.
Damn.
Awake–I read your post as the most “analytic” and so I watched the video again.
YOU SAY: “The ‘provocation’ for the shooting of these civilians was that there were two reporters talking to them, and a small group of people gathered around.” /// The audio clearly states “the provocation” was a man holding an RPG. Was this the same guy that was holding the camera or an different guy? Seems to me an RPG is noticeably diffferent than a camera with a telephoto lens.
What exactly is the outrage here? That mistakes are made or that reporters should never be shot at? Did the copter know there were reporters in the area? Should that make a difference?
I note the somehow “misplaced” concern for the injured guy mid-video. Crawling away from the attack, he could be shot at again “if he reached for a gun” but evidently not if he just slowly bled to death? Weird.
Likewise the ambulance/van. Why again were they shot at? Because they were picking up the wounded or did or did not have an rpg with them?
Pro or con or whatever was going on, yea, War is Hell and half that hell is that mistakes are made AND that you are well advised not to be in a war zone.
Kinda puts my day to day issues into perspective.
War may be hell, but it’s their home. What the hell are we doing there? Creating more terrorists, I think.
The courage that I saw came from the people in the van who came to help. Just to be shot down like dogs safely from above. Superior firepower does not make you a better man. And the little jokes (albeit gallows humor, a coping process), is inexcusable. The people defending this action are just a bunch of chickenhawks who have never served a day in the military.
Unbelievable.
After looking at the video on a larger screen. There does appear to be two men with weapons (3.39). The get lost in the frame as the gunner keeps focus on the two “apparent” weapons that ended up being the cameras. You don’t see the other two anymore, at least I didn’t. Would I have fired up the group of men or the van, I would like to say that I wouldn’t, but I was not there. and everything is 2020 in hindsight. People are aware that this happened on 2007 right?
They obtained and decrypted the file? Sounds like crap to me. No one would leak an encrypted file. The other option is that they hacked into a machine and stole the file. It’s obviously real, but I think these guys are taking more credit than they are due.
It’s sad to see this has happened and who knows how many cases of this there are that we haven’t found out about (this video is from a couple years ago).
I respect what some people in the military do but a lot of them are just trigger-happy rednecks that would be shooting cars with machine guns on shooting ranges if they weren’t in the military.
Judging by the time between the firing and hitting the target and the fact that the M230 gun mounted on an Apache has a muzzle velocity of 2600 ft/s, then I’m guessing that the helicopter was a mile away from the target. Also the people seemed completely unaware of the helicopter. I think a smarter idea would be for the Apache to track the target while they await ground forces to arrive. The ground forces can use a spotter and verify the target before engaging it.
#13 gets my vote. Beyond that don’t hang out with guys with guns in a war zone especially if you have your kids with you.
This was not during the war, this was after we liberated the free and democratic peace loving shining beacon of Iraq
Would you object if these were British helicopters shooting catholics in Belfast?
What about Spanish helicopters shooting Basques?
Or US helicopters shooting blacks in the next LA riot?
2007 NYT article on the incident
No matter how you cut it this is distressing to watch. This approach is not working – we need different tactics. These things will feed terrorism zeal for years to come. Men in advanced military aircraft with high speed large caliber guns shooting men with alleged riffles and a Canon camera. I could not see the RPGs (and they had them they were not pointed at the helo). Not good.
Cool, I don’t see a problem.
good argument for drones. apparently drone operators can take time to view the situation and be as accurate as possible about the existence of “hostiles” and “weapons” before launching the attack.
Of course they dont have gatling guns on them where you can dust up the area to your hearts content…
The video clearly shows US forces firing on a civilian vehicle attempting to retrieve wounded persons from the scene.
Any supporters of US involvement in two Iraqi wars want to explain why attacking those assisting wounded is OK?
Seriously – being able to differentiate between cameras and weapons would seem to be vital to US interests in both the Iraq and Afganistan theaters.
Attacking civilians and or ambulances is terrorism and war-crime.
Try to imagine the shoe on the other foot.
How do you feel about the emergency personelle caught up in the second World Trade Center attack?
They were trying to save lives too.
Unless the USA can realise that an eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind, the USA will continue to lead the world to armageddon.
This is not how peace and stability was rebuilt in Europe and Japan in the 40s & 50s.
If the Iraqi people want this to stop, they need, as a community, stop hostile behavior.
In previous wars, it would be carpet bombing into submission…or two very big bombs… the the country in question would surrender.
In these two wars, the people are not involved (in the fighting). There’s hostiles and our armies. The PEOPLE need to get involved and pick a side.
get some! ya, get some!
The first part I of the video I can understand, 2 guy with big bags and 2 other guy with AK in the back. Other guy peeking around the corner, all look can be mistaken for bad guy trying do something.
Obviously the VAN came over to help somebody is wounded like any Human being would. Unless they come see any weapons drawn out of the van there si no reason to engage. Plus they’re on a helicopter far away with very good camera systems. Also sound like the gun man adrenaline is out of control. “Just Pick up a weapon” shouldn’t be saying anything like that.
The guys in the helicopters were arrogant pricks that don’t care who they shoot!! They would shoot their own mothers if it would get them a badge of honor!! You could have told them, hey there’s a field with kids playing, go shoot them, and they would, because hey, they’re not american kids!! They’re scumbag Iraqis right?
Sadly, some people in this forum will not get the irony of this Pete Seeger song:
What Did You Learn In School?
http://youtube.com/watch?v=VucczIg98Gw
Isn’t this cruel????
First you Capture one country then your untrained soldiers take their own decisions at any place and then after any mishandling you just say that “This was just in a MISTAKE”. How many innocent people die by your mistakes???Who will pay for this?
Simply you all will BURN IN HELL and be ready for this. The one and only SUPER POWER GOD will see you.
Maybe people will get it when these tactics are used on US soil.
Enjoy your Fascism
“can i shoot, please god say i can pull the trigger right now… looks they are calling the medics! shoot them now right!?”
Having flown combat missions in the first Gulf war, though not close air support, I can’t see anything wrong with the ROE there. Lots of radio chatter, but definitely not murder, they disengaged when the threats were neutralized, engaged when they had confirmation of weapons, didn’t engage UN or emergency vehicles. That’s how it works.
The video starts with guys running down the street, and it sounded like troops on the ground got the Apache on target. Was that the case, did these troops confirm the weapons? At 3:40 the two guys in the back of the frame look very armed to me. One guy with an AK the other with RPG. Also it sounded like there were guys on the ground that confirmed the weapons. Video doesn’t say if the US soldiers on the ground pushed these other guys down the street or not, or if the guys on the ground also confirmed weapons. 4:17 looks like a guy taking aim, though that does look like a camera (not sure that’s the smartest thing). As far as the blue van. There are no UN or red cross markings on the van, so it has to be considered hostile.
Bottom line if you are a journalist and embed with a terrorist force, you may get shot. Secondly running around with long camera lenses and guys with small arms in the midst of a military operation offers a pretty good chance to get hurt or killed. What else can you say.
Note to Obama:
Get out now.
Pull everyone now.
Stop wasting time and lives.
If they want to kill each other, fine.
Pull 100% of our troops now.
Nothing else makes sense.
Do it now.
If (as claimed above) according to first hand accounts of US military experience, the kind of action depicted in the video is normal – the USA are most certainly it’s own worst enemy and an unmitigated nation of hypocrites.
Bottom line – if you treat the lives and safety of other people with callous disregard expect that other people may treat your life and safety similar disregard.
It’s not difficult FFS, Christ even said so;
So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.
Matthew 7:12
Do to others as you would have them do to you.
Luke 6:31
(BTW what the F are you supposed to do with a camera apart from ‘aim’ it?)