When NPR went looking for someone to speak out in favor of “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell,” thy could not have found a better representative of thinking on that side of the aisle than Duncan Hunter. Wait a sec… did I say thinking because that clearly not a problem that afflicts Congressman Hunter.
Duncan Hunter: the military is not civilian life. In think the folks that have been in the military… that have been in these very close situations with each other, there has to be a special bond there. But that bond is broken if you open up the military to transgenders to hermaphrodites to gays and lesbians.
NPR: Trangenders and hermaphrodites?
Duncan Hunter: Yeah, that’s gonna be… uh, uh, uh… part of this whole thing. It’s not just gays and lesbians. It’s the whole gay lesbian transgender bisexual community. If you’re going to let anybody in no matter what sexual preference that they have, that means the military’s going to let everybody in.
I can’t tell what’s stranger: that Duncan Hunter is in a rash about hermaphrodites invading the US military, or that he thinks being a hermaphrodite is a sexual preference.
So, what do you think about Obama’s wanting to change the policy? Should homophobes be considered more of a liability in the military than gays? If you feel gays shouldn’t be in the military, do you feel blacks and women shouldn’t either since they also can’t help how they were born? When you’re being attacked by the enemy, which is more important: the guy next to you can shoot straight or that he’s not gay?
#65-Mikey Twit-Must feel lonely watching the world leave you behind. We’re better off with out ya anyway.
Comical how you expect others to tolerate your perverted lifestyle while on the other hand you refuse to tolerate opposing opinions.
I guess there’s nothing worse than an angry queen who doesn’t get “its” way.
Main Entry: crack·pot
Pronunciation: \ˈkrak-ˌpät\
Function: noun
: one given to eccentric or lunatic notions
#60, pedro, great sidestepping my question, which you still haven’t answered. Where is your scientific proof that gays choose their lifestyle?
Yeah, didn’t think so.
#56
Clearly, you are a simpleton. Obviously, it would be ridiculous to discharge a soldier JUST because he/she had heterosexual relations (and no other related circumstances). I guess hyperbole is beyond you? The point is, oh social troglodyte, that a gay solider CAN be discharged for JUST having homosexual sex. See the difference? Should I type with smaller words so you understand?
The details of that encounter is anything but irrelevant when doing a 24/7 life/death job!!!
Bullshit. So, you are suggesting that all soldiers in the past 100 years have, in detail, outlined their every sexual encounter to their superiors? After all, they are anything but irrelevant. What planet indeed. Apparently, you are coming from Fantasyland.
Currently military people are dishonorably discharged all the time for all kinds of sexual behaviors within the unit, both heterosexuals and homosexuals. Basically anything not work related is inappropriate.
Both true and false. Yes, people can be dishonorably discharged for heterosexual relations. However, there have to be extenuating circumstances surrounding the encounter. If a soldier goes into a bar, picks up someone of the opposite sex and has sex, that alone will will not raise an eyebrow even if the encounter is relayed all the way up to the Pentagon. However, if a solider does the same with someone of the same sex, they will be dishonorably discharged. Do you not see the vast difference?
#60
Perhaps you should try reading before posting. As I said from #47 It may or may not be genetic, but it is innate nonetheless.. You can have innate behaviors and proclivities that are not genetic. For example, birth defects are not all purely due to genetics.
#64
Your conclusion does not follow the premise. It is equally possible that without social stigma that soldiers with homosexual proclivities were able to freely act on those tendencies whereas in modern society they are not. In the modern military, if you are found to be gay you are dishonorably discharged. If you are thought to be gay, it can impede your ability to get promoted. Thus, there is no way to know how many people in the military really are homosexual but are hiding that fact. Yes, people can strive to hide the fact that they are homosexual. They can abstain from having homosexual sex just as heterosexuals can. Are you saying that heterosexual proclivities are entirely by choice and that we are born with absolutely no proclivities towards people of the same sex or opposite sex and that all such behavior is learned? There is ample evidence to disprove that hypothesis the simplest being that no homosexual was raised to be homosexual.
#73, so if you claim there is no scientific data claiming this is either genetic or a lifestyle, then your position is no more right than any other position, hence your argument is baseless.
Nice, you just shot yourself in the foot.
#73
I was going to suggest that while the evidence to support the notion that homosexuality is genetic is lacking, there is plenty of evidence that it is congenital. However, I would be mistaken: http://sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/06/080628205430.htm
Apparently, there IS evidence to show that it is genetic as well as shaped by environmental factors.
#71 Are you suggesting is a birth defect? Wow!
You are obviously trying (and failing) to be cute. Many behaviors and attributes are not genetic but are still congenital and thus not a choice.
#63Dodd
in both cases – choice it the common factor.
I made no comment on choice just the “deviant behavior” that seems to scare you is in noway a restricted to a “San Francisco street gay-fest”
For the record I think some people are born gay, some bi and pick gay and some straight and pick gay for a lifestyle but it doesn’t matter who they sleep with in noway hurts you Dodd.
If I were to judge you on the merit of your character I’d say you are a coward, afraid some one near you might be gay. If something so trivial frightens you so I’d not want you in my foxhole.
Gay or straight at if you are in the military you know when to keep it in your pants what you do in bed on leave is not Dodd’s concern
#67 Dr Dodd
Oh, how nice calling me a gay term in a derogatory manner, insinuating I must be gay for defending such a position. Doesn’t insult me whether I was gay or not(I’m not by the way), but ironically it’s usually those who rally the most against “deviant” behaviors, who end up being the ones most guilty of them. See: Ted Haggard, Larry Craig, etc.
As far as tolerance, I tolerate all viewpoints, even those I don’t agree with. It’s when those viewpoints are part of a pattern of keeping people down or discriminated against then yes, I guess I’m intolerant of such things. How GLBT people will destroy your “way of life” is beyond me. You will still be free to be a bigot in your own private way, but yes, in public areas of life (government, military, public policy, business, etc), exclusionary, and discriminatory viewpoints need not apply.
#78, please quote me where I said there was scientific evidence to support my claim. Oh, that’s right, I never said it. Who’s the loser now? Oh, that would be you, because you have no more evidence than anyone else! HAHAHAHA!
#78
I realize that you have trouble reading past the first few sentences, however, I did in fact provide evidence. Further, no one said that homosexuality is a defect. That’s your own sophomoric invention. A person’s sexual preference is congenital. If it were not, that would imply that people’s heterosexual preference is also not congenital but instead learned. There is simply no evidence to support such a claim. The vast majority of people that are homosexual were born with proclivities towards people of the same sex just as heterosexual people were not taught to have proclivities towards people of the opposite sex.
#76-it doesn’t matter who they sleep with in noway hurts you… If I were to judge you on the merit of your character I’d say you are a coward
Oh really? Because I disagree with your finely honed political correct brainwashing or because you fail to take into account deviant behavior in a society affects everyone.
How convenient of you to forget the AIDS plague unleashed upon the world thanks to the promiscuity of the homosexual community.
Now there is need to destroy the cohesion necessary for our military to function properly.
So you see this is everyone’s concern. It’s just your blind arrogance and lack of morality keeping you from seeing the danger ahead.
#77-Mikey Twit-As far as tolerance, I tolerate all viewpoints…
I know, you tolerate all viewpoints as long as they agree with yours. Very Democratic of you
#83, sigh. This actually very easy. Where is the evidence to support your position? You tell everyone else that they have no evidence, yet you have none yourself. Your opinion is based on what, pulling things out of your ass?
# 81
Dr Dodd said,
#76- If I were to judge you on the merit of your character I’d say you are a coward.
“Oh really? Because I disagree with your finely honed political correct brainwashing or because you fail to take into account deviant behavior in a society affects everyone.”
Because you are afraid other people just because they are different than you there private behavior inconsequential you.
“How convenient of you to forget the AIDS plague unleashed upon the world thanks to the promiscuity of the homosexual community.”
ADIS transmission can come from bodily fluids exchanged via anal, vaginal or oral sex, blood transfusion, contaminated hypodermic needles even between mother and baby during pregnancy, childbirth, and breastfeeding. How cowardly of you to need a scapegoat to blame.
“Now there is need to destroy the cohesion necessary for our military to function properly.”
Glad military is not made up of Dodds. This will in no way destroy the cohesion necessary for our military, just more of you stating your fears.
“So you see this is everyone’s concern. It’s just your blind arrogance and lack of morality keeping you from seeing the danger ahead.”
By your standards I’m sure I live a very moral life, straight, married, never cheated on wife, don’t drink, smoke, toke, use any controlled substances, I don’t spout obscenities, I have a normal BMI and own a very efficient car that I try to drive as little as possible heck I even recycle, I give to charities with my cash and volunteer my time and talents to help those in need. I pay my taxes with out complaint even when Bush wanted to spend it on unnecessary wars.
I live up to most of what folks like you think is GOOD and RIGHT.
This works for my life but I would not be so full of Hubris as to think its the only way to be. No two people are alike. I am not blind, arrogant, or lack of morality and I don’t think YOU have any right to preach what is deviant behavior to people you have never met and don’t understand.
I don’t have any faith in a supreme being but I think you would benefit from some of the lessons in John:Chapter 8. What right to you have to be stone throwing?
Dr Dodd
“How convenient of you to forget the AIDS plague unleashed upon the world thanks to the promiscuity of the homosexual community.”
How convenient of YOU to ignore it was promiscuity of a HETRO population that saw the disease take off.
If I didn’t tolerate your idiocy, I would be crying to Dvorak to have you banned, but I would never and will never do that, because censorship here or anywhere would deprive everyone of your viewpoint and drawing their own conclusions.
Your preoccupation with “deviant” behavior is actually kind of scary. What people want to so sexually between consenting adults, regardless of sexual orientation, is none of your or anyone’s business.
The problem for some reason with you lies in if you discover that certain people(gay or straight) have sex a “different” way than you deem appropriate, you feel there entire life must be judged by that. You are free to feel that way, no question. Just as I am free to think you’re a small sad, bigoted, narrow minded person
#83
You are a child arguing that Washington isn’t on the one dollar bill. There is scientific evidence that establishes that homosexual tendencies are congenital or determined at very early age (first few years). Furthermore, there is no evidence that any other adverse or abnormal events in a person’s life affects their sexual tendency at any age.
You directly equated homosexuality with a birth defect, not me.
Again, you are being childish. I was establishing that some human attributes are not due to genetics but still congenital.
Behaviors are not congenital.
Then you are also suggesting that heterosexual behavior is not congenital. In other words, if children are brought up to their teens with zero influence on their sexual tendency (or we are able to factor it out statistically), you are suggesting that they will randomly pick the sex of their partner and that is simply not the case. The species could not survive if that was the case. There is no question that majority of subjects would pick someone of the opposite sex. That suggests that behavior is not learned. Btw, there is this from the American Psychological Association:
Changing tacks for just a moment, suppose, just for a moment, that sufficient evidence came to light that convinced you that homosexual tendencies were not a choice. Would your opinion on their right to serve in the military be changed? From what you have said, I doubt it. That would mean that this entire discussion of whether homosexual tendencies are congenital or not, is a red herring. It is an orthogonal excuse to justify your personal feelings about homosexuals.
#85-Howard Beale-I don’t think YOU have any right to preach what is deviant behavior to people you have never met and don’t understand.
Interesting. You have no problem preaching to me about what I should think and what I should believe.
You play the roll of hypocrite quite well.
#88, YOU have no evidence. You’re just pointing at me saying “Look, he has no evidence” to direct attention away from your lack of evidence.
Very sad.
There is no congenital behavior! Jebus!
Wrong. I have already provided evidence to the contrary.
And now, to add more mud to you pool, you come up equating that a mental disorder or dysfunction is a choice in that sea of molasses that you wrote in that post.
Too many words for you to grasp? It was you that said that behavior is in the arena of psychiatry (see post #73). You were also wrong on that.
There are no congenital behaviors.
Again, you would be wrong. From the article I posted: Homosexual behavior is largely shaped by genetics and random environmental factors Continuing to shout out something that is patently false will not make it any more true.
On top of that, where the hell have I written my opinion regarding gays in the military?
Then answer my question: if, by some miracle, you were convinced that homosexuality was innate and not a conscious choice, would you be in favor of letting homosexuals openly join the military?
#86-Mikey Twit-How convenient of YOU to ignore it was promiscuity of a HETRO population that saw the disease take off.
You forget that AIDS became politicized… of course it took off after that.
The ironic part is the same people who worked to keep society from blaming homosexual activity contracted AIDS and eventually died.
This because they wouldn’t allow the disease to be fought like other viruses beginning with quarantine.
You should read more before you call anyone a small sad, bigoted, narrow minded person. It makes you look ignorant.
#88
BTW, to thoroughly trounce any notion that congenital behavior does not exist:
http://pnas.org/content/94/5/2001.abstract
All this nonsense bickering is analogous to having an argument with the KKK. It just validates that cynicism is alive and well.
The facts –
1. Like the KKK,the loonies in here do have the right to be what they want.
2. To have a rational debate you need rational people on both sides. Not the case here.
3. We all need to be vigilant as to not set off the old loonies in here into a shooting spree at the local museum.
#92 Dr Dodd
Hahahaha, You calling me ignorant! Hahaha. Now that’s rich! Thanks for the laugh!
I guess in the end it’s what people who view the world you do really inspire in the rest of us; after the anger,and rage, it’s the fact that we end up laughing at you because the world still keeps moving forward, while you choose to stand still. It stops being sad, it just becomes a hilarious.
#94 Dallas
Well said.
It does seem unfair to have a battle of with with a poorly armed or unarmed enemy.
# 89
Dr Dodd said,
on February 8th, 2010 at 3:34 pm
#85-Howard Beale-I don’t think YOU have any right to preach what is deviant behavior to people you have never met and don’t understand.
Interesting. You have no problem preaching to me about what I should think and what I should believe.
You play the roll of hypocrite quite well.”
Not at all Dodd
This is a forum where we get to debate our views. I say live and let live and I’m not telling you to weather you having sex with people of your own gender is right or wrong. You can think and believe what ever you want.
I do think it is wrong of you to try to force your beliefs on others. DADT is a law you support(maybe you want a complete ban instead I don’t know) that that oppress a people just because you are afraid of them.
If you want to try to talk gays out of being gay or serving in the military fine talk away, if you want a LAW that oppresses people that’s different.
I fail to see where your accusation of hypocrisy sticks.
#95-Howard Beale-I do think it is wrong of you to try to force your beliefs on others.
In this forum? You’ve got to be kidding.
Besides, since when is stating a point of view forcing beliefs? And if that’s the case aren’t you doing the same thing?
And if you are doing the same thing then…
wait for it…
Hypocrisy, your name is Howard Beale.
Who the hell cares if homosexuality is genetic or choice? Isn’t America the Land of the Free? Home of the Brave? You homophobes are like hysterical little schoolgirls that don’t even know what they’re frightened of. Or is THE BIBLE that makes you irrational fraidycats?
Btw I respect your right to be homophobic and appreciate you being up front about it, but I equally reserve my right to criticise and make fun of you because of it.
I apologise to any schoolgirls that may have taken offence at being compared to homophobes. 😉
#98
You fail to see the difference,
My point of view is we share ideas here on this forum and I encourage you to try and give me some reason to think all those with a sexual preference different than your own are some how less moral than you and less deserving of equal rights, IE get jobs in the military. (my bet is by your own scale I’m just moral as you maybe even more moral unless you have a problem with freedom of religion too)
Your point of view here is that you want to force beliefs on others by supporting laws like DADT. your support of such a law is out of line in a free country.
no Hypocrisy sorry