Couple Ordered to Stop Holding Bible Study at Home Without Permit – FOXNews.com — What? Does this mean I cannot have a few guys over to watch a football game either? It’s kind of religious.
Pastor David Jones and his wife Mary have been told that they cannot invite friends to their San Diego, Calif. home for a bible study — unless they are willing to pay tens of thousands of dollars to San Diego County.
“On Good Friday we had an employee from San Diego County come to our house, and inform us that the bible study that we were having was a religious assembly, and in violation of the code in the county.” David Jones told FOX News.
“We told them this is not really a religious assembly — this is just a bible study with friends. We have a meal, we pray, that was all,” Jones said.
A few days later, the couple received a written warning that cited “unlawful use of land,” ordering them to either “stop religious assembly or apply for a major use permit,” the couple’s attorney Dean Broyles told San Diego news station 10News.
I hope they sue the hell out of those anti-religious bigots. What happened to the right to assemble freely?
I wonder if the ACLU will get involved?
Fox News? Slow news day John?
I suspect there’s more to it than that. Were they claiming any tax benefits related to their “bible studies?” How else would the government even have known about it?
I’m all for religious freedom despite being a atheist myself, but I have taking their word for it. They do believe in an invisible man in the sky, after all.
^Have a hard time taking their word for it.
Much of these licensing regimes are either a revenue grab for the licensor or an anti-competition barrier to entry for protecting pre-existing interests from newcomers. Doesn’t surprise me that the local government would look for a way to squeeze more money out of people.
I hope we see more of this…these stupid Jebus believers want to push for prayer in schools, we can push back!
In our area there was a Buddhist monk leading meditation in his home, but the group became so large that eventually the township had to break it up to keep the streets clear.
If it isn’t disrupting traffic or disturbing the neighbors, I can’t see why they would do this.
And yes #1, the ACLU supports Christians in cases like this all the time when the facts allow.
How many people were coming over?
If it’s truly a few the county needs to have its ass handed to it by the ACLU….if it was 20-30 they may have a point.
There are no details here. They could be having one person over or 200.
Part of the “more to it” is that someone leaving the bible study ran into one of their neighbors’ vehicles.
The comments on this posting also provide some additional information:
http://ballew74.newsvine.com/_news/2009/05/28/2872851-couple-county-trying-to-stop-home-bible-studies?threadId=589428#c7326779
And you may want to look into the case of the Iron Oak Church in Florida as well. It was a far more decisively anti-worship case there: http://www.ironoak.org/articles/articles.html
According to the local news story, there was an average of 15 people attending. 15 cars on a street every week… or every night? Kind of a nuisance especially if it’s a narrow street.
http://www.10news.com/news/19562217/detail.html
Seems like we must be missing some facts. There are surely thousands of bible studies in San Diego county.
#6 So you’re OK with using the power of government to bully those who are exercising their constitutional right? Stunning!
Let’s see,
Freedom to Assemble…not
Freedom of Religion…not
What if government officials judged by due process to be in willing infringement of the Constitution could be made to forfeit their privilege to work in government.
Think that might help?
Damn it.
“Bible Study” was the perfect cover for one of my business ideas. Now what?
This is yet another They’re out to get us story that doesn’t hold water.
#11 – tecban
Good link.
#8 – 20 to 30? Hell, my family’s Thanksgiving dinners have more people than that…
If a crowded street is the issue, then carpool. Still, if there’s no law being broken (other than this apparently horseshit law requiring a permit), the ACLU should jump all over this.
I’m an atheist, and frankly, I hope they win.
Good!They want to retain their ill-deserved tax status, then then damn well should ONLY practice their tax free cult activities in a registered building so people can easily avoid it if they wish and not be put to any more inconvenience (parked cars, bad drivers etc) than they already are.
#17 Well that’s a real shame that you see someone exercising their rights as an inconvenience.
“Tax-free cult”? you are a very clever person! A gold star for you my friend…
@1 “I hope they sue the hell out of those anti-religious bigots”
I’m an atheist and you have my vote.
Whatever happened to land rights?
It sounds like this is a story about a zoning violation being spun into a story about the government attacking Christians. They were told they need a major use permit not a permit to hold bible study.
I don’t think San Diego County is going door to door asking if people are holding a religious service. Obviously someone complained about their activities. It would piss me off if I came home every Thursday night to a street full of cars and not being able to park in front of my house because someone is across the street for bible study.
#19 hehe thanks! If I plan on running, I’ll need all the help I can get. Some might say I need professional help but that’s another story 🙂
“I’m an atheist and you have my vote.”
Hey that’s cool by me…I’m a religious person but I just want to live my life, be free to exercise my Constitutional rights, and not violate the rights of others. I say live and let live but that’s not good enough for some, including some in our government.
And I agree with your question…what about land rights/property rights? Unfortunately, like any of our rights and freedoms, they are being eroded (whether by zealots or by overly complacent citizens who choose not to stand up).
If these folks are indeed violating law, then they should find another place to meet. So far, from my point of view, it seems like a small group, within their rights, being unfairly treated by bureaucrats. It’s not right and the ACLU should get involved.
umitsfoxnewsreportingneedanymoreinfo?
How often were they having these meetings? If it’s every night or every other night or day, that would be like having a drug house with cars lining your street.
But I’m inclined to go on & let them practice their bonehead religion, which is its own punishment.
Fifteen cars in the street could be an issue and none of us would challenge the city’s right to remove the problem.
The city is free to issue parking tickets for blocking streets and to tell people to move their vehicles off the street. None of that is a legal issue.
They said get a license for big bucks or stop meeting for worship and that is an issue.
Yeah I have to say, if the facts are as stated so far, this is fantastically frakked up. Even assuming the 15 people each drove a single car… you can fit 15 cars in a couple of streets without causing *any* traffic disruptions. (And as someone pointed out, a traffic disruption should be dealt with *traffically*.) Methinks that #5 is righter than most here.
I do wonder though if the courts will look at it as a freedom of religion issue or a freedom of assembly. Easier to go with 2, since the Bible study issue is “collateral”. (Assuming the facts are as stated.)
I’m agnostic, and don’t have any problem with Bible, Buddhist, Muslim, or even Hindu study groups in homes as long as they play nice with the neighbors…
They should start doing more of that.
I have had more people at my house for my kids birthday parties. This is ridiculous! The government has no right to tell someone they can’t meet with people in thier house for a bible study. If it was indeed a neighbor who called the city to complain, whatever happened to being a good neighbor. How much are we going to allow the government to control our lives? If I was irratated about parked cars in front of my house I would simply go over to my neighbors house and talk to them. The government has so much control because we no longer take responsiblity for ourselves!
#28, mom,
So if the neighbor complained and the next night his parking spot was again taken, and the next night, and the next night, and … , I think he has a right to be pissed.
Instead, he did the correct thing which is to contact the City to have them take care of the problem. The City believes the gathering to be contrary to local land use.
Remember, your freedom of religion and freedom of assembly do not include the freedom to interfere with my peaceful existence. This has nothing to do with First Amendment rights and everything to do with being a public nuisance.
Let me get this straight.
Some of you are in favor of trading freedom of religion AND freedom of association, for convenient parking.
Right?