Daylife/Getty Images used by permission
|
The more often Americans go to church, the more likely they are to support the torture of suspected terrorists, according to a new survey.
More than half of people who attend services at least once a week — 54 percent — said the use of torture against suspected terrorists is “often” or “sometimes” justified. Only 42 percent of people who “seldom or never” go to services agreed, according the analysis released by the Pew Forum on Religion & Public Life.
White evangelical Protestants were the religious group most likely to say torture is often or sometimes justified — more than six in 10 supported it. People unaffiliated with any religious organization were least likely to back it. Only four in 10 of them did.
The religious group most likely to say torture is never justified was Protestant denominations — such as Episcopalians, Lutherans and Presbyterians — categorized as “mainline” Protestants, in contrast to evangelicals. Just over three in 10 of them said torture is never justified. A quarter of the religiously unaffiliated said the same, compared with two in 10 white non-Hispanic Catholics and one in eight evangelicals.
Is anyone surprised?
Would Jesus torture? I don’t think so. His dad might though. That guy was a real bad ass. Just read the Old Testament.
Recently I’ve read 2 different articles on the economy:
“Men suffer higher job loss rate than women”
“Women bear greater burden in recession”
It all depends on how you ask the question.
WWJD – What would Jack do? (Jack Bauer)
Surprised, no. Bothered that some people who consider themselves good Christians can’t think clearly despite their vaunted WWJD orthodoxy. And it is orthodoxy that is the problem here. Any set of rules which demand adherence don’t allow independent thought. This is NOT what Jesus wanted of course. The problem is that when these people get use to getting told what is right and wrong, as if they were in the military following orders, then OFF! go the minds and ON! goes blind obedience. It’s a lazy form of living where most decisions are made for you. You don’t have to think as much nor figure out what is really right or wrong for yourself.
So, they are told that so and so only does what’s right or knows what is right. Instead of thinking “is this right?” they simply follow what so and so says or does blindly.
Torture is never justified. The ends does not justify the means. And one person in history (several of course) stood up and showed people that torture was horrible by letting himself be tortured to death for a crime he did not commit. Now Shrub and his admin are the Romans and those who were wrongly imprisoned and tortured and died while in our control are the ones being crucified. Even if we handed them off for someone else to torture, then we (and I use the term loosely) are no better than the pharisees.
Jesus was tortured – and then crucified. 3 days later he was feeling much better. And he turned out to be a very nice person.
If its good enough for Jesus, then its good enough for Al-Quaeda.
Reagan was a RINO.
Poor Alfie, clinging so desperately to his totally unrealistic hypothetical situation, spouting his bible verses… this whole issue has got him quite unhinged.
Glad to see NONE of you that have responded so far care for anything other than “Eye For An Eye”.
The Country is NOT an Individual. It is a Representation of a society. It is nothing more than a mindset. Yet, people think they need to defend it with Torture.
It is not bad enough we sell the enemies weapons. Its not bad enough we take over countries. Now, we also have to stoop to the level of ignorance and say “Oh, this torture stuff works.”
America got to be the shiny beacon on the hill because IT DOESN’T EVER Treat People (All PEOPLE) as lesser than Human. This is what Torture does.
Torture doesn’t have a ‘Safety Word’. It doesn’t know when it is almost too much for the victim. It is a War Crime of the Highest Echelon. It is taking someone, who may or MAY NOT know anything, and subjecting them to terror and pain and fear that the life they know will be ended.
This is not Christian Thinking, and in fact, dates back to the Inquisition.
I am glad we learned So Much from the past that we feel the need to relive the ignorance.
But Alfie provides us with a window into the Christian Taliban mind… if they all think like him, that would explain their support of torture.
I’m pretty sure the Islamic Taliban tortures too. It’s always like that, the fringe elements always have more in common with the fringe elements of other religions than they do with the less fringe elements of their own religion.
How does it feel, Alfie, to be the spiritual brother of the wacko Muslims?
A better headline for this post “People who believe in a vengeful punishing deity more likely to agree with torture”.
so, what i’m gathering here from the posts is;
Jesus = jack bauer!
the second coming is here!
with a Vengence.
(Die Hard, Again!)
So, elderard, you’re the actual religionist seeing as how you seem to know all about how a Christian should act. This article ‘appears’ to say that those evil Christians are responsible for the torture doctrine. This is a hypothesis, however. We can’t let Christians take over, the evil they would do… This isn’t true and would never happen. The real torture is watching the left flail around looking for others who ‘appear’ to be worse than them.
Is anyone surprised?
#13 Silly wacko… that treaty said nothing about who was being tortured. Soldier, civilian, didn’t matter. Whoever you wanted to torture, IT’S WRONG. Not that you have shown much capability for introspection, but how does it feel to realize that Saint Ronnie of Alzheimer’s was too liberal for you?
Actually Alfred, the Convention covers combatants, whether uniformed or not.
I was waiting to hear you weigh in- I didn’t know if you’d try to use your religion to justify torture or not.
Further Reagan thought- it was a terrorist that killed the Marines in Beirut. His response was to withdraw the Marines.
#15 Hey, good point! If torture’s good enough for god, it’s good enough for us, right??? 🙂
sigh… this thread looks pretty dead… just Alfie repeating his cherished unrealistic hypothetical situation, everyone else pretty much agreeing that torture is wrong. I’m outta here.
Alfred1 said:
Anyone who wouldn’t [torture] is not fit to be a leader of the people or even the head of a family.
Just wanted to highlight this part.
As I recall Hitler, Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot were Humanists — and boy, did they torture!
What happened to the white Russians in America under FDR?
Did FDR use the atom bomb on the Japanese because they were a different race? He was winning anyway.
What torture techniques did Lyndon Johnson use on the Viet Cong?
Are there over 100 unaccounted for murders of people who had been around the Clintons?
If waterboarding was used as hazing at the academies, why wasn’t it called “torture” then?
Why does the liberal movement need people external to themselves to “hate?” Is it a hate group? Are they using hate speech?
Tim- Truman made the decision to drop the bomb, not FDR.
#7 I find your post quite compelling on the issue of torture and what it is. And I find my thoughts colored by your quotes; I’ll look them up in context.
Let me point out though that this article isn’t focusing on torture and what it is. It’s merely trying to show what Christians think about torture. Why do I care what a group that actually claims that it’s members are broken and are in recovery think? Why do you care?
The little jab at the end says what eld. thinks about it.
Sounds right. Have you read the bible? nothing but severed heads stuck on pikes.
Didn’t the Spanish try this a few hundred years ago to weed out the non believers. The darn things have propagated again and have to be removed all over.
Why can’t people just do as I say, then the world would be a better place. (for me)
#28,
For over 3 years, he saw Peter’s sword, yet never did He tell Peter to not wear it…or use it.
That is bullshit. Peter bought that sword with Thomas about a week before it all went down. Wal-Mart had ’em on sale. Simon asked them to pick one up for him but it was illegal to buy weapons without ID in Israel.
FYI, there is a great difference between self defense and torture. Torture is done on a captive, not a combatant.
#28,Alphie, Evangelical, Sociopathic, Right Wing Nut, Loon, Limbaugh Sycophant, and Quaalude Queen,
As for Reagan’s pulling out the Marines…that’s not relevant to his views on torture…it only shows his ability to adapt to facts on the ground…
What is that? Cut and run?
They figure they’ve been through torture by going to church all the time, so why not everyone else.
“Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everybody. If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God’s wrath, for it is written: “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,” says the Lord. On the contrary: “If your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head.” Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good (Romans 12:17-21).”
Nothing about torturing your enemies, funnily enough…
So these Christian Torturers would be in favor of their children experiencing Corporal Punishment in school if their kid was suspected of wrong doing?
Alf- you appear willing to say anything to win an argument.
OT: I hate my iPhone.
Alfred keeps spouting the same straw man argument. Did any of the torturing that happened in Guantanamo, Abu Ghirabi, or any of the CIA secret prisons involve saving a life of someone who was in imminent danger?
NO, it did not.
It was done primarily to advance a political agenda, to prove al-qaeda was in Iraq before the war started.
That was NOT a “Christian” thing to do, completely unjustifiable, and worthy of jail time for the perpetrators and the people giving the orders.
But Alfred1 what about..
“But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you (Luke 6:27-28)”
Sounds like you should be doing a little more prayin’, and a little less hatin’ and torturin’.
#39, plus there’s the fact that here in the USA law takes precedence over religion.
As Alfred knows, when religion takes precedence over laws then we’re pretty much the same as Saudi Arabia or Afghanistan.