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“Make yourself look bigger as to scare away the gay.”
Damn, that was funny.
For the same reason liberals are against polygamist marriage?
Conservatives are against anything in a striped shirt. That includes mimes.
#2 OK, I’m not getting this. Why are conservatives against gay marriage but are OK with polygamous marriage?
Wow, I never realized polygamy was such a polarizing issue. I’m sure it will be on the new RNC chairman’s agenda.
# 4 QB said, “#2 OK, I’m not getting this. Why are conservatives against gay marriage but are OK with polygamous marriage?”
Got me.
#5 Sam
Up in Canada there is a court case coming over the polygamous sect in Bountiful BC. The big argument against conviction is that it violates their religious freedom. Have fun when this shows up in the US – you guys have avoided prosecution just like Canada for years.
It’s interesting, the right and the left are both split on this case. Most of the problems I see with these wacky Mormon sects have to do with age and informed consent.
The word ‘marriage’ has always meant a life contract between a man and a woman. Gays have already co-opted the once unencumbered word ‘gay’ and and the once unencumbered symbol of the rainbow. People who are married shouldn’t be put in the position where they need to explain they are married to the opposite sex. Gays should pick a new word for their new concept if they want to broaden support for their cause.
PaddyO what makes you think liberals are against polygamy? Or incest marriages?
±, I have no idea why you chose to use a perfectly good mathematical symbol for your name. I think you should use the more traditional western style approach to names and not force people like me to constantly explain whether I’m posting to a forum or really talking about mathematics.
You see, I’m not against symbols, I’m pro-alphanumeric.
MikeN, nice.
I thought I’d outgrown these black and white instructional films, but I guess we’re never too old to learn that mismatched screws and holes can make everything fall apart. Potential catastrophes like this just make me want to duck and cover under my desk.
Gary l’infidèle dangereux, ROTFL
#10 QB, props for a good analogy 😉
“2
Actually, I doubt that they are similar at all. Nearly every opponent to gay marriage that I have met opposes it at a visceral level. In other words, they are repulsed. The few opponents that don’t seem openly “repulsed” usually are trapped in the dilemma of “I would support gay marriage if only I could figure out what God thinks about it!”. But they are rare. The arguments against gay marriage are designed to sound like arguments for objective truth, when they are really just reflections of subjective desires.
I am OK with that to the extent that all morals are subjective. But I am also OK with fighting strongly for something in which I strongly subjectivelybelieve. People’s subjective desires change. There will come a day when people will treat the issue of homosexual rights like we do today with any civil rights. Those who oppose them will be the one’s in the closet.
And yes, I do talk about rights while also maintaining that morals are subjective. The notion of a particular right arises when we wish to do something (or avoid doing something) that our culture is using coercion to stop us from doing (or forcing us to do.)
I don’t spend much time thinking about polygamy. To the extent I do, my opposition is more a matter of insuring that people are not exploited. The institution of polygamy is nearly always an exploitive relationship.
#9 said “PaddyO what makes you think liberals are against polygamy? Or incest marriages?”
They are not against incest marriages, where do you think they come from!
#16 Too easy, no points.
The institution of polygamy is nearly always an exploitive relationship /// Yea, but what makes it different from monogamy?
Repulsion has little to do with anti-gay marriage. No one really complains about ugly, old, fat people getting married.
No==put it all down to religion. Stupid unthinking controlling anti-happiness anti-individualistic anti-free RELIGION.
# 18 bobbo said, “No==put it all down to religion. Stupid unthinking controlling anti-happiness anti-individualistic anti-free RELIGION.”
Really? Then why do I know atheists that are against it?
#8
People, at one time, also assumed that everyone outside their immediate cultural group were inferior and when said group gained enough power they felt it was justified by their god to exploit those they could.
Things change. Marriage will too. You, of course, can believe and feel what you want. You can belong to any religious group you want and they can refuse to “sanctify” any marriage they wish. But our nation should not refuse equal protection under the law. Getting “married” confers benefits and “rights”. Marriage should be open to one and all as long as it is not exploitive (which eliminates marriage to children or polygamy.)
On polygamy. Has anyone followed up on what happened at the YFZ RANCH where they hauled off over 460 children nearly a year ago “for their own good”?
I argued at the time that this was a grand gesture of an overreaching police state against the freedoms of the individual.
And apparently the courts agreed with me.
http://tinyurl.com/65kudq
# 20 Chris said, ” But our nation should not refuse equal protection under the law.”
It already does. Look at taxation.
“18
“Repulsion has little to do with anti-gay marriage. No one really complains about ugly, old, fat people getting married.
No==put it all down to religion. Stupid unthinking controlling anti-happiness anti-individualistic anti-free RELIGION.”
Being repulsed does not guarantee that the person wants to make something illegal. But that doesn’t change my point. I will concede that religious tradition does play a roll.
#19
“Really? Then why do I know atheists that are against it?”
Atheist don’t follow a particular dogma. They merely claim that there is no justifiable reason to believe in god. I know some atheists who are Libertarians, too. I am just as perplexed.
#19–Paddy-0-Zero==that is the insidiousness of religion. It teaches all kinds of really stupid things, hateful things. Some escape its grasp and deny the superbeing but are still hampered with lots of other stupid ideas. Misogyny, mystical thinking, not sure about science, anti-gay==all sorts of stupid things.
How come you can’t figure that out for yourself?
# 24 bobbo said, “#19–Paddy-0-Zero==that is the insidiousness of religion. It teaches all kinds of really stupid things, hateful things.”
Bzzzt.
Wrong answer McFly. 😉
bobbo and chris, Paddy-O tends to bait along the lines of Christian==Conservative==Smart and Atheist==Liberal==Dumb. It’s an easy structure and explains why the Republican base is shrinking. I don’t Paddy actually believes all that stuff but he does provoke people.
The whole Mormon sect polygamy thing screams abuse and that’s why most people dislike it. Pure and simple.
How about a professional couple in Manhattan who are married but have agreed to have relationships with other people out of convenience and to further their careers? While not technically polygamy, it is certainly is in the spirit of it.
“# 20 Chris said, ” But our nation should not refuse equal protection under the law.”
It already does. Look at taxation.”
Questions like taxation, which require normative judgements are ultimately social constructs. They have to be worked out within our society.
The idea that a person with wealth unequivocally deserves all of that wealth and deserves the full violent power of the state to protect, is itself a social construct. I dislike excessive state power, so I am sympathetic to the libertarian impulse, but I am more incensed by the fact that too many millions of people live in inadequate homes, have inadequate health care, and inadequate and demeaning jobs. I am also angered by the philosophy that America is some unique good in the world and that all of our wealth and freedom is due to our peculiar virtues. We too often ignore the fact that our wealth and power is more due to landing on a resource laden continent along with our slave labor and a willingness to “take” as much wealth and property from the native americans who came here first (who, granted, often took it from tribes that came before.)
#26
I know all about Paddy-O 🙂
People should be able to do what they want, for the most part, as long as it is mutually agreeable. If a couple wants to share their resources, so to speak, that is fine, whether it is in Manhattan or Utah.
# 27 chris said, “Questions like taxation, which require normative judgements are ultimately social constructs. They have to be worked out within our society.”
Marriage fits into this also…
IMHO, it’s not so much that ‘conservatives’ are against gays. In fact half my friends and most all of my family are conservatives yet we live in total harmony.
The issue lies in that “conservatives” once was associated with small government, freedom and fiscal responsibility (when I was a conservative).
Today, the ‘conservative’ mantra has been hijacked by the church to serve as a Trojan horse to government infiltration. Along the way, they had to find a;; the “boogie men” they can find because their rally the troops fuel is hate and division. Gays happen to be the low hanging fruit that plays nicely into most scriptures.