 Jack Layton, Stephane Dion, Gilles Duceppe announcing coalition
Daylife/Reuters Pictures
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Opposition parties in Canada have joined forces to try to topple the minority Conservative government less than two months after elections.
The Liberals, New Democrats and Bloc Quebecois say the government is failing to tackle Canada’s economic problems. They intend to use their joint majority to vote against PM Stephen Harper in a confidence motion due next Monday.
If Mr Harper loses, Canada’s Governor General would call a snap poll or ask the opposition to form the government. Constitutional experts say Governor General Michaelle Jean may favour the second option as the country has had an election so recently.
It would, however, be an historic decision as Canada has only had a coalition government once before – in 1917…
The prime minister could try to ride his luck and let the confidence vote go ahead on 8 December, or he could try to stave off defeat by asking the Governor General to suspend parliament until 27 January when the government is set to table its budget.
The tension is palpable. :)
Of course, the object lesson of multiple parties forming a ruling coalition is so terrifying to U.S. pols, I would expect intervention by the CIA at a minimum.
#31 – Noel
>>Pray tell, are you from Quebec, or at
>>least Canada?
Don’t pay no nevermind to Angry James. He’s still smarting so badly from being owned, pwned, and dominated by the Americans here, he figured he’d try blowing his hot air on Canadian topics.
Since there are fewer Canadians out and about here than Americans, he feels his chances of getting away with his tomfoolery are increased.
27. Named
No complaints about any political party elected and pushing any agenda they want. Just let them scratch for their own money like the rest of us. What a nice little unaccountable pig trough they have. No wonder Canadians are suspicious about politics and politicians.
Don’t talk to me about democracy and elections when it appears parties listed on a ballot can be elected claiming to be something or representing ideals they can easily later change on a whim. You know they can do this, don’t you? You think this is right? This is not some arcane policy, this is fundamental.
Canadians did not elect a nation-killing party to govern. That they might, is a bit of a democratic joke and clearly a flaw in the system. If no one points out these flaws, nothing will be done about them. That’s why and how new laws are introduced.
What you really mean to say, is “they can legally do it, so that makes it right – regardless of what the public’s actual political will might be.” These parties can now be seen to have suckered all Canadians in the last election with their claims of who and what they were. This may be good enough for you, but not for me. And I doubt most Canadians either come next election.
My point is that we need something new and different to deal with this flawed and inefficient democratic process.
I’ll re-phrase again if it helps. There can be no doubt that the Prime Minister, the leader of Canada, is an understatedly important position directly affecting the lives of a nation. I hope you’re not trying to dispute that point.
Now tell me again how voting for a local good ol’ boy is equal to the PM responsibility in any way other than theoretical and vague.
If you are creative, you will understand there are better forms of democracy, other than what Canadians currently practice. To suggest the only other Canadian democratic option is terrorism, is just amusing.
RBG
For the record, all the grousing by Harper about the opposition parties striking a deal with a “separatist” party(the BQ) is B.S. and disingenuous. When Harper was in opposition in a minority Liberal government a few years ago, it’s well documented that he and the Conservatives were in talks with the BQ in bringing down the government of the day and governing in a coalition if the government fell. The deal never went through, because the Liberals called an election before the government could be brought down.
34 Mikey. Political posturing is one thing, actually doing it in the face of world economic calamity, quite another. The actual request was “to consult the opposition leaders and consider all of your options before exercising your (GG’s) constitutional authority.”
35 jbellies. Coalition self-destruction & new election may just be Harper’s “Just watch me.”
RBG
28,
I get you now. You have no idea about what the real issues are (the budget) but the ones that satisfy your illusions of grandeur (Harper putting forth a flawed budget knowing full well that it would lose confidence, thus exposing the nation to the threat that is the Bloc. The Bloc not know it’s thus being used by the minority government allows the coalition to be formed only to thrust forth its separation mandate on the unsuspecting Canadians and blammo! Quebec becomes the biggest french country in NA!)
So, tell me James…. Was it a plane that hit the Pentagon or not?
33,
Wait a second… do you honestly believe that I think that politicians are trustworthy? Prostitutes are the same as politicians, except you generally screw the prostitute as to the opposite with the pols. Now, on top of that, prostitutes seem to have a lot more integrity. So, let’s just eliminate the “vote for one thing, get another after election” because that is par for the course.
Next, the coalition is not nation-killing. That’s US style fear mongering. Harper tried the most cynical ploy possible. He wanted to push X amount of things in, but cynically he did X+1 with the full intention of removing the 1 extra, which was campaign financing. I’m not opposed to federal funds for opposition parties since it’s done on a proportional scale (more votes = more dollars) AND it ensures that we keep a rich field of parties and candidates, which is by far one of the most important tenets of democracy. So, he cynically said let’s put in this and we’ll add the other and look like friendly hokey types by re-funding the opposition. Lost out on that one! So, in that manner, yes, Harper should have been caught out and his party should push him out too. There are better back stabbers in the wings (Peter McKay) that they can use next.
“Now tell me again how voting for a local good ol’ boy is equal to the PM responsibility in any way other than theoretical and vague.”
Ostensibly, the purpose of voting is to choose a candidate that suits your ridings needs best. We don’t vote for the Prime Minister. Hell, he can lose his riding and STILL become PM. All politics start at the local level.
“If you are creative, you will understand there are better forms of democracy, other than what Canadians currently practice. To suggest the only other Canadian democratic option is terrorism, is just amusing.”
You know, when you equated Bloc funding to Al Qaeda, you set the standard for dissertation VERY low.
Americans LOVE the 3 billion dollar, 2 year pageant that is called an election. We can knock one out in 6 weeks and no riots.
There is no perfect political system, unless you use Socrates Sun-king. But, in a modern, stable democracy, the Parliamentary system is FAR superior to strong man Republican systems. Afterall, most of the worst places to live in the world are republics.
“The BLOC WILL work within the coalition as long as agreements are reached”
The Bloc wants two things: more pork for Quebec, and the devolution of as much federal power as possible to the province, with a view to the eventual breakup of the country.
The economic program of this coalition will be diastrous for Canada. Its members are far to the left of, say, Obama. Think Barney Frank in charge of the United States.
Harper is a fool for stirring up this hornets`nest, but Canadians will pay the price.
It`s arrogant and stupid, as well as pompous, to attack people`s ideas by attacking their grammar.
RBG, you have it bang on.
Ok we voted him in for a purpose: Dion was a fucking twat, the NDP leader was a commie, and the green lady was a retard. Ok, so now we have a strong leader. Yes, there have been job losses in the automotive industry but that’s becouse of the US crisis.
By overthrowing our stable government, the morons will do the following:
-Make us loose faith in voting.
-Hate Dion more then we do.
-Never vote liberal .. ever.
-Seriously, when they were in power, money simply ‘dissapeared,’ there was no economic growth and Canada was basically dead.
To every reasonable person out there: do not let this happen.
42 Named. They’ve lost it all? Where did it all go? To social programs? Maybe you need to talk to the US about their spending and their economy. And while you’re at it, the rest of the world.
You either want the Conservatives to take charge and take responsibility for their actions or not. Make up your mind. The ridiculous consequences of a minority government is you can’t run things the way you want. No one is really in charge.
A government run by multiple masters – the compromising minority gov’t situation – is like a person being told to jump over a creek while another orders him to stay put. Guess where the compromise puts him?
If .oo2% of the budget is not worth talking about, let’s also raise MP salaries + perks & shovel a little my way while you’re at it. See how that boosts political confidence with the tax payers. It’s only a couple measley .001 percentages. Pork, thy name is Named.
You know the Bloc will never win a majority in Canada because that would be a disaster, right? You admire their tenacity. News flash: These guys are about to take power.
“that makes your local MP or MPP very powerful indeed.” Yes, all 300+ of them are always quoted in the national news and have such an effect on world leaders. Seriously though, on average how much more powerful and influential do you think the PM is over the average MP: 10X? 40X? 100X?
RBG
I’m a little lost here. Isn’t this about trust and confidence in the current leadership/government?
This raised it’s head because of NO CONFIDENCE. Some might say it was planned. Some might say it’s dirty politics. Some might say it’s a power grab. It actually doesn’t matter.
In a minority government (which Harper CLEARLY has both in votes and popularity), you have to keep the confidence of the opposition parties.
His last term was NOTHING BUT CONFIDENCE vote after confidence vote.
If you put something forward and make it a confidence vote, you are daring to be challenged. If you do it enough times, if you keep poking the opposition with a stick, you get what is coming. You get a lack of confidence. If it’s the same government tatics, same people “in charge”, walking around like they own the place… another term of poking… you will quickly find out that you do not own the place. You will find out that in fact the dog does not have a leash you are poking.
Harper had a chance to make it better this time around and failed. It does not matter if the opposition has a bogus reason, if they loose confidence, they get to topple the government. That’s how it works. It is MEANT to work this way.
I honestly thought Harper could put the genie back in the bottle, but I have to tell you, all I hear now are the babblings of a bully finally being ganged up on by the victims.
The comments he is now making tell me 100% that he has lost ANY chance of keeping the confidence of the opposition parties. If it was a bogus reason that got us here, Harper has just written it in ink that he can’t lead. This government is dead/lame duck. Bring it down, quick. Let’s get this over with.
# 7 Named said, in part:
“Well, why do you Americans hate NAFTA so much?”
As best as I can make out, besides the xenophobes and the folks who just hate all kinds of “foreign entanglements” (warned against by G. Washington in his farewell address), it allowed the export of a large number of jobs south of the border (those few that hadn’t already been shipped off to China, VietNam, Singapore, Haiti, Chile, etc., etc., etc.).
# 12 Noel said, in part:
“The NDP wouldn’t want out of NAFTA if the US held up their end of the bargain.”
That sound interesting — how has the US not held up their end of NAFTA?
44,
The population voted 39% for the conservative party. That means a minority in votes and the Parliament. Harper had to compromise and work along with the opposition. Every province in Ontario wanted federal aid during this crisis that the US created. Harper told them all to stuff it. You honestly think that every conservative member in every province was happy about that? His mini-budget was crap. He addressed absolutely NO issues and the only thing he took charge of was inciting the opposition and then denounce said opposition for calling him out. The very definition of a cynic.
As for federal funding of the opposition. It’s a good thing. You might not like helping out the loser in an election, but that just makes you a lousy person. A democracy is defined by supporting those below as much as those above. Perhaps more so since they have less of a voice.
As for the fear of the Bloc again… You honestly think that the Bloc is going to say “I want out of Canada or the coalition fails” and the NDP and Liberals are going to say “Yeah, sure, whatever.” You’re obviously a paranoid fool. The coalition would collapse before that happens.
If the PM has the confidence of his party, the PM can be very powerful in ensuring the members toe the line. If he does a boneheaded move like Harper, well, he can threaten all he likes. The MP’s can push him around too for being such a fool. Of course, the other MP’s can just say “Yes Harper” and put their brains on hold.
Now, remember. I don’t trust a politician as far as I can through them. But, I DO trust our government system to make sure they are kept in line. And this latest event is a perfect example.
46,
Actually, NAFTA is a clusterfuck. No doubt about it. Yet, no government would consider untangling it. The multinationals would NOT allow it. And they write the laws these days.
As for the US not holding up its end of the bargain… Constantly, the US flouts the agreement. Just look up softwood lumber. And the amount of subsidies the US gives to its farmers? Though most Americans don’t realize it, you have the most socialized corporate system since the NAZIs and the Fascists. So, yeah, the rarely hold up their end of the bargain.
#43, Dane,
I guess you have never heard of Brian Mulrooney. He left the country on the edge of bankruptcy. It took the Liberals to not only turn the country around, but years to balance the budget and turn a surplus.
48 Named. 74% of Canadians did not vote for the Liberals. Yet we find this least popular of all leaders is going to assume PM leadership. Reality check, please. They say love is blind. Love of power would be more precise.
You think the Bloc is not now going to demand political payback from the beholden to jump-start their – up until now – languishing separatist, nation-destroying goals? This is manna from heaven. Or you think the separatists are going to use their new-found power in support of a stronger Canada? Tell me about being foolish, let alone naive.
Regardless of what Harper was doing or not doing, it certainly wasn’t a perceived crisis by anyone except the power-hungry opposition. Especially in view of last quarter’s rising trade surplus in the present world economy, and in what was relative Canadian stability. It sure in hell is a crisis now. And the opposition could have easily defused what is now an unprecedented bona fide national emergency.
So there’s no doubt in my mind that this will all lead to a new election shortly. With a shell-shocked and weary public handing the Conservatives an even bigger majority in pursuit of any kind of stable government. The Liberals have now shown their coalition cards and the Conservatives will also be viewed as the only non-separatist alternative.
RBG
Harper was only elected as an MP. The Prime Minister is only that: an MP appointed by the Queen (via the AG) as the leader of parliament. The minister is chosen by recommendation of parliament and is consequently almost invariably the leader of the party with the most seats. Constitutionally, the opposition parties may (by never have) form a coalition. This type of coalition is actually quite common in “young” democracies before the inevitable concentration of power leading to (ostensible) 2-party or (de facto) 1-party systems. For this reason, I would argue that such a coalition is progress in the direction of a more representative democracy.
The reason this is happening and happening now is that Harper has attempted to cut off the main source of funding for all parties but his. I’m not sure what he was thinking but it seems that he assumed that the opposition would cut their own throats rather than trigger another election so soon after the last one in October.
The irony in this is that Harper has proven himself to be a “sharp” politician who has risen to power by subverting the democratic process in a number of interesting ways (look up Chuck Cadman, David Emerson for a start) and who is only in power through his own coalition.
The proposed coalition of three of the four federal parties represents 63% of the Canadian electorate. The current minority government represents only 37% of the electorate. Most Canadian donot wnat harper as prime minister, and even more do not wnat Dion as prime minister. But, most canadians would rather have Dion as prime minister if it means getting rid of Harper, because they willhave Dion only until May 2009, when a newe and more popular Liberal leader will take over.
The Conservatives are currently running a smear and lie campaign to befuddle those Canadians who are stupid enough to fall for it.
This coaition will be an opportunity to bring in proportional representation to replace the first-past-the-post electoral system we have now.
54,
It was mentioned previously, but the purpose of the public funding of federal parties is to eliminate the buying of votes from lobbyists. Its a more democratic version of campaign financing.
As the party in power, the federal conservatives could already USE the public funds to campaign ahead of dissolution of government. I guess you think that’s a “good thing”.
Since you’re so afraid of the Bloc, feel confident that the Conservative party is not. In fact, they tried to form a coalition as well with the Bloc. From the Globe and Mail.
http://tinyurl.com/5pbfye
54,
FYI. In parliamentary systems, the Finance Minister is the most powerful portfolio. The PM is more of the manager of the party.
And now that you know that, you can adjust your logarithmic formula.
Just show me the Official Residence of The Finance Minister.
And any the signed Bloc/Conservative deal you cite. If there was one, the Conservatives deserved to crash & burn as well. Which they did anyway. If they were privately exploring, so what? It’s always good to know all the creative options – good and bad – before making a decision.
RBG
We Canadians don’t know what a “leader” is, we havn’t had one since Trudeau until Harper. I relish in the idea of not opening the paper and reading about scandals on a daily basis like was the case when we had 16 yrs of a liberal named Chretien. The separist’s should have been charged with treason years ago and for the NDP Rae almost destroyed Ontario with thier policies…. so ya Harper is a welcomed relief and voted in by the people.
57,
If I put a huge ring on your finger and stick you in a nice big house, that doesn’t make you the Queen. Especially when I’m the one that will be funding your escapades. You may like to dress up in the pretty gowns, but without the FM, you’re nothing.
Enjoy the pageant!
The Finance Minister serves at the pleasure of the PM. Now consider how amusing the reverse scenario would be to understand the power disparity.
I get a kick out of the opposition and their statements that the Conservative government has “now” lost their confidence.
If an opposition hasn’t lost the confidence of their opponents even before an election, let alone after, I don’t know what they think they are doing in politics. It’s disingenuous statements like that which prove the bogus system of minority government. And the underlying reason for backroom power grabs.
52 Bob Mckenzie. You inadvertently left out Ujjal Dosanjh and Belinda Stronach: politics as usual. 1.2 inch headlines in the morning paper screaming “A NATION DIVIDED,” and the serious fallout that goes with that, is not.
RBG
At Mister Mustard, no it wouldnt be a 2 party system, if a coalition is decided, the 3 partys in the coalition, Liberal, NDP and Bloc, will take over canada. I really dont like NDP and Bloc and Stephane Dion cant back up his opinoins.