Ah, remember the good old days when Americans didn’t have to worry about so many wrong address home invasions by the cops who used to protect them or being tased when you have a broken back, border guards (Canadian now, US soon?) weren’t doing the dirty work of private companies in confiscating MP3 players that might have downloaded music on them, we didn’t send prisoners to other countries to be tortured, the government wasn’t eavesdropping on every phone conversation and email sent, we didn’t have Vice Presidents forging documents to help start a war, and so on and so on? Good times, good times…
Just think. There are children being born and growing up who will never know the horror of having to live with all those nasty freedoms we oldsters once had. They’ll actually wonder why we considered Soviet life oppressive!
aND THE question is…
What happens when you take away personal ownership, and rights to own GUNS away from the people.
What i find funny, and humorous, is that long ago.. When something BAD was happening…everyone would get together and FIX it..
If a house was on fire, the WHOLE neighborhood would HELP put out the fire.
IF the Sheriff needed some help, he ASKEd the Cits to help gather up the BAD guys..
Are we MADE so busy, that we cant HELP our neighbors..??to KNOW who they are..
with Canada customs you would think you were in Stalinist Russia – only that in Canada you think you own items – and then you are taxed to death
All for “free health care”
“I’m from the government I am here to help you”
Its one giant cancer all for civil service staff putting in time for their pensions while in the case of border guards – its the fun of asking questions – not listening to answer and then politely molesting you
Just asking questions sir
Didn’t we declare independence from a King who did pretty much everything our government is doing today?
I’m not really sure why Americans are criticizing Canadian border control for being too stringent.
I hear you guys are putting up some sort of wall on your other border. Besides the iPod checking will likely never come into effect as the conservative party does not have enough votes. They keep delaying the legislation because they know they can’t pass it.
Aren’t you guys the ones who just put into writing laws allowing computers to be seized indefinitely and transfered between government departments.
HEIL BUSH!
What happened to the free speech zones? Everyone seems to forget those. They were the first sign of how things were going to change under Bush and co.. What made anyone think that a national trajedy would not get exploted to further their start towards a dictatorship. The problem is not what the “leaders” are doing, it is that we aren’t yelling at them to stop.
#6 – “I’m not really sure why Americans are criticizing Canadian border control for being too stringent.”
It’s not just about Canada, it’s worldwide. From the article:
“…Called the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement (ACTA), the new plan would see Canada join other countries, including the United States and members of the European Union, to form an international coalition against copyright infringement.
…
The deal would create a international regulator that could turn border guards and other public security personnel into copyright police. The security officials would be charged with checking laptops, iPods and even cellular phones for content that ‘infringes’ on copyright laws, such as ripped CDs and movies.
…
‘If Hollywood could order intellectual property laws for Christmas what would they look like? This is pretty close,’ said David Fewer, staff counsel at the University of Ottawa’s Canadian Internet Policy and Public Interest Clinic…”
Doesn’t even sound as if reasonable suspicion of thwarting terrorism is the foil for this authority of privacy invasion. Of course, they could always invoke the “stopping child pornography” argument, and what politician is going to vote against such a law?
See also:
Homeland Insecurity rejects standards for search, confiscation
http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=19441
Remember, revolutions are started by the people.
Or is the beer and HDTV too much of an opiate to allow you to get mad enough to storm your capital????
Cursor_
You forgot to mention the good ol’ daze prior to 6 billion people suddenly becoming bloggers.
Kinda makes you wonder who really is winning the war on terror?? Trouble is many of us were all for whatever it takes right after 9-11. Now that it really starts to effect our own freedoms we have second thoughts. Its a two way street with freedoms. We not only give those freedoms to ourselves but to those who may use them against us.
Its a very high price indeed.
As the blending of countries and the bluring of borders continue through out the world. So also will the trading of values between people and Governments.
In the past the people of our country felt strongly about self relieance. (JFK Quote “Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country.”) In the past when some one stole from you, you tried to get that thing back yourself instead of crying to the government about how you were mistreated. This reliance on the government to solve problems has limited our freedoms.
Case and point. I don’t want to be hit so we make a law about hitting people. Then I get thrown in jail because I protected myself from getting hit by hitting. The law did not protect me, it just injured me in the end.
Other countries have had issues in the past with terrorism. They have done much the same things that have been done these last few years in these countries. Be prepared because our country is going to continue following the same path regaurdless who gets elected.
(BTW free health insurance is not free. We pay extra in taxes for that insurance and loose the freedom of choice on coverage. Case and point Surgeries in Canada have a waiting list based on case severity. This means that no matter how much pain you are in because of the problem, if it isn’t life threatening your going to wait till they can schedule you in before you get relief. Many cases have Canadians comming to the US for surgery to take care of issue because they could not wait for care in Canada.)
#3, Welcome to Canada,
with Canada customs you would think you were in Stalinist Russia
I visited Canada twice within the past three months. Both times I was treated quite nicely, asked about six questions,: where you going, what citizenship, got guns, got tobacco, how long you staying, anything to declare, then thanked, wished a good day and to enjoy our visit. It took less than ten minutes total. Returning both times on returning to the US we waited in line for about 1 to 1 ½ hours and almost had to give our life stories.
All for “free health care”
Bullshit. “Free Health Care” is what the American wing nuts call it. It is single payer health care. What most Americans pay to insurance companies for sub-standard care, Canadians pay to their various provincial Health Insurance programs which in turn pay the physicians. I wrote “most Americans” because so many can’t afford health insurance.
The rest of your diatribe shows how delusional you are. Either you have serious mental problems or you are actually an American who listens to Rush Limbaugh for an understanding of Canada.
*
Every Canadian I have ever met likes the Canadian health care system. Yes, there are portions that could be better. On the whole though, 100% of the population is covered. Elective procedures may take some time but serious and emergency situations are treated right away.
My father, at 85 had a knee replacement. The wait between diagnosis and surgery was about two weeks. Total cost? $2.00 for the use of the telephone. At 87 he underwent surgery and chemo for colon cancer. No cost, he used his cell phone. The wait was about one week. His cancer was not completely eradicated and is currently undergoing another round of chemo at 88. No cost. No problems. No financial anxieties.
Recently, someone I know had to wait for the insurance to authorize the surgery. The surgeon had to convince the insurance company before we got the go ahead almost a month after the diagnosis. Then they wouldn’t pay for more than one night’s stay. They then balked at the chemo so he didn’t start that until almost four weeks after the surgery. After the insurance pays their bit, we will owe about $10,000 for everything and have a much higher risk of re-occurrence. Maybe a sure bet because of the waits.
*
and then you are taxed to death
Canada has a balanced budget and has payed down most of its debt. Its economy is vibrant and relatively healthy. In contrast, while the US has lower taxes, its debt continues to grow and its dollar has devalued against all other currencies, including Canada’s.
People like my father, who fought for Canada in WWII and my mother who worked in the war industry at home, and after the war helped build the country are taken care of. Their pensions help them live a good life. Their drugs are inexpensive. They are not forgotten and tossed aside as yesterday’s newspaper.
A woman I knew here, lost her husband during the Korean War and her only son in Vietnam. Her life consisted of deciding whether to eat or pay for her drugs. So welcome to the wing nut’s America.
#15 No one ever said that America was perfect. However you seem to think Canada is. Why are you still living in the US?
Definition Wingnut: any person that I(I being the user of the word) don’t agree with. Note: Use of the word causes the people you don’t agree with to stop caring about what you say, and will most likely stop them from agreeing with you?
Mr Fusion
Congratulations. You are one of the few here who has their head screwed on right concerning Canada. A health care system provided by the government eliminates the outlandish greed of the US insurrance system.
Wonder why cars produced in other countries are priced lower when they still pay their workers a reasonable wage. One third of the car’s cost isn’t to provide health care to the workers, and a quarter isn’t for excessive greed on the part of CEO and upper management.
When the population stops being people and assumes the role of serfs, then Cheney and his Bush baby puppet will be happy. Bush can continue making believe he is a big important person, and Cheney can steal even more of your wages for his oil.
That’s right, everything was much bettter in the old days, wasn’t it? It’s just the current regime that’s backwards and repressive. Life was just peachy under every other administrationin history.
Did you forget something?
McCarthyism and J.Edgar Hoover’s vast blackmail/wiretapping schemes?
The imprisonment of large numbers of American citizens who happened to have Japanese ancestry?
The continuous state of fear imposed on us during the Cold War?
The era of ‘Life before Miranda’, etc. ?
The era of common lynchings and open KKK activity/terrorism?
The era when black people couldn’t vote or were subjected to ‘poll-taxes’? Or were subjected to arrest and beating for being in the wrong bathroom/drinking fountain?
The era when there was no medicare or medicaid at all and poor people hoped for charity from hospitals and doctors?
Life before OSHA, FDA and other elements of government that protect our basic safety and health?
Life before the proliferation of vast numbers of grants, scholarships and other programs that enable not-so-wealthy citizens to get an outstanding education?
Get in your time machine and go back to those wonderful times. I’ll stay here.
#16, CZ,
#15 No one ever said that America was perfect.
OK, so what is your point?
… However you seem to think Canada is.
Where did I allude to that? Please post the exact sentence where I said Canada is a better country than the US. If you start at the very beginning of the post, you will notice that it is in direct reply to what some idiot wrote. It was referenced by both post number and name in order to avoid confusion. Quotes from specific parts were in italics.
Use of the word [wing nut] causes the people you don’t agree with to stop caring about what you say, and will most likely stop them from agreeing with you?
First, it is TWO words. While counting may not be your forte, that wasn’t rocket science.
Second, I doubt you would have read the post anyway, use of “wing nut” or not.
Third, the writer of that post is a wing nut. As well as an idiot and uninformed tool.
Fourth, you didn’t rebut anything I wrote. You resorted to plain ad hominem attacks.
Fifth, As an American I would rather make this a better home for my child. Your motives for not making this a better place remain inexplicable.
Sixth, your “America, love it or leave it” attitude is reminiscent of the worse of what America has become.
Seventh, your lack of caring is obvious from posts on other threads.
Eighth, your misunderstanding is not in sync with America.
78% are unhappy with current medical insurance, 62% like a single payer system
The two largest concerns Americans have about health care is cost of health care closely followed by the related covering the uninsured.
Ninth, If you don’t want to read something I wrote, that is your prerogative. While I can humbly appreciate the idolization, I don’t live for it.
Tenth, go cry to someone who gives a rat’s ass about your being associated with a wing nut.
#19: Of course some things are better. But do you really think the things I listed are good things?
One step forward, one step back.
#16
Why waste words on Mr. ConFusion?
People like this live in a very black/white world-view. Everyone who doesn’t share that view or thinks that there are a lot of gray areas in life that don’t fit into a particular political dogma will be assigned to his wingnut, moran[sic] file. He is not interested in hearing, much less entertaining, other points of view; he can’t synthesize that into his constricted, fragile, black and white world so he lashes out with a continual stream of hostility and insults against any perceived threat, without regard for facts or the freedom of speech that the rest of us enjoy. He is a bitter little guy. Poor guy.
See also: Borderline Personality Disorder
No matter what the circumstances, things can always be better or worse, all depends on what you recognize as issues that need fixing, and those that don’t.
If you like the status quo==then point to all the good things now, the bad things then, and claim everything is fine.
If you want to make things better, point out the issues and offer solutions.
That way, hopefully, we can get two steps forward without 1-2 BIGGER steps backward.
#22–moranaguy==more with the generalized personal attacks? Sad. You can agree or disagree on Fusion with the facts/argument he offers. I disagree with his criticism of Czen because he is quibbling about his praise of Canada. Its weak to argue “I didn’t say exactly that” when the general direction and meaning of what was said is plain enough===but there is meat and value to what he posts.
Your posts and CZens posts have no such value. Raise your standards, avoid the purely emotional and ad hominem, try some facts and web links–you have several role models to use, including Fusion.
#22, hanahmontana,
Great ad hominem attacks. I notice you didn’t refute ONE word of what I wrote. Instead of presenting any facts, you paint things with a broad brush.
My assessment that you are a moran has yet to be disproved.
#23
I agree, things can always be improved, but I feel we have made tremendous strides in this country in view of past social injustices, the environment, our movement to more open scrutiny of government affairs, our safety nets for children, the elderly and poor. Healthy debate occurs when people realize that every utopian idea, social program and government policy may have unintended consequences (housing projects in the ghetto?) or even dire effects. Most of the commentary here is hate-filled sloganeering and bashing of other people’s opinions. Doesn’t move anything forward.
#20 Attacking me for a space in between two words…wow…I’m hurt. Your genius is just compelling. I just wonder what would happen if you did something similar. Wait you did in Post #25.
Well this post has gone from an attack on the current political environment to health care. Not quite what was on the agenda for the day (I’m partially to blame. Sorry Dvorak readers.), but amusing none the less.
Canada is not perfect so why would we junk our system for theirs.
To move forward, meaningful debate has to occur and that will not with people pointing finger.
Note: For those people wondering where the mistake is in post #25, it’s between the I and the period.
Note: For those people wondering where the mistake is in post #25, its between the I and the period. Common edicate asks for either one or two spaces between the closing period of a sentence and then next sentence. Note: just for pointing this out I could be counted as bigotory as some.
#24, #25, #27
“birds of a feather….”
“..thou doth protest too much…”
I agree, more facts, less dogma and name calling. Web links are often frivolous window dressing, as most of those posted here lead to the depositors choice of other biased resources – not to good, critical journalism or investigation of both sides of an issue.
Which of the issues that I brought up in #19 are you arguing with as not being factual? Anyone who has taken a history course or lived through those times doesn’t need to be led to a web-link to affirm their memory.
#21 – I’m referring to huge shifts in our society in a positive direction. You choose to dwell on the incidents that are going to occur in any society of 100’s of millions of people that reflect badly on some individuals and some aspects of government. It’s easy to do that. I could do it all day. What’s the point? It’s just tabloid, v2.0. Take tasering for example. It receives a huge amount of anecdotal attention on this board, but I grew up in a time when cops didn’t have tasers – the result being the use of blackjacks and clubs, with devastating consequences – inevitable skull fractures and permanent brain injury. Not to mention having to pay for the medical care and disability for cops who engaged in close combat with perps. Sure ,inappropriate use of any weapon by the police needs to be investigated and certainly is in our area. If that’s not happening where you live, then get out and do something about it. Raise hell! Otherwise, get real.
#29–montana==if websites are too often window dressing, how would you characterize unsupported bald assertions?
I believe our excellent Moderator tried to direct your attention to the majory element of your error at his post #21–still not too late to take a stab at his challenge.
Yes, every time and place has its pro’s and con’s. Where/when you might want to live can be variable. I suppose if you want to be cured of cancer, it might be 20 years from now. If you want to raise a family based on one working income and be secured in a retirement program, that indeed could be the 50’s-60’s. And so forth.
I like your initial take on tasering. I agree its selling point is it avoids the use of guns and battons, but it also increases the use of electrical shock to secure compliance or to punish whereas in olden days maybe talking, threats, or ignoring may have been used. Again==unsupported bald statements do not serve as well as window dressing.
#30 = bizarre post
What unsupported statement did I make in #19 and #29? Could you be more vague? You’re disputing that any of that happened? Do I have to refer you to a history book? I’m looking at the big picture of change in our society, not the daily tabloid sensation headlines brought forth in the heading of this post, which seems to be the focus of everyone else, those who like to sit in their cubicle and take potshots at the horrible state of things out there. Your post/link in the ‘Britain Threat assessment’ heading is a perfect example of a biased, bizarre, undocumented, sensational and frivolous web link. Does that satisfy you as clearing up a “bald statement” or do you need more?
#31–Silly Rabbit, Trixs are for kids.
#30
Naivety posing as opinion. Apparently you didn’t live in the 50’s as I did. “Talking, threats or ignoring…” weren’t used like they are in your dream world. Cops walked around with one hand on their billy club and nobody talked back to them. And when they did, the unfortunate results didn’t receive the public scrutiny they do now. Things are better now, in spite of what all the cop-haters say. Again, big picture, not sensational tabloid headlines.
Montanaguy, I hate to have to say this, but you’re a blind idiot. Good thing you aren’t a doctor. You can’t recognize when increasingly bad symptoms are telling you something is wrong.
“Hooray! We fixed this Uncle Sam guy’s broken leg. Let’s go party!”
“Um, but he’s rotting out with cancer and he’s been shot in the head.”
“Yeah, but he doesn’t have a broken leg anymore! Woo hoo!”
#9: You forgot NASCAR, NFL football, and beer. American pablum for the unwashed masses.
#34
Very eloquent. Keep up the good work. Focus on your tabloid headlines – that seems to invigorate the bitter masses. Ignore the progressive work that good people have done in the last 5 decades to improve our country. Enjoy negativity if that suits you. Life in this country is just terrible, just awful. The patient is nearly dead!!! Last one out, turn off the lights. It’s my fault that I can’t see it through your dark glasses, isn’t it? Choosing not to recite the script of doom and gloom continuously doesn’t make one blind. I would make a bet any day, face to face with you, that I have seen far more death, destruction and despair than you in my life. Very few people have worked and lived in the places I have during my life – ghettos, inner cities, indian reservations, V.A. hospitals, combat and on and on. I choose not to be stuck on the negative as you do. That’s the easy way out for many.
Who’s blind?
How did John Dvorak’s name ever get associated with this forum? He’s the one columnist I eagerly await each month for his pithy insights. Nothing like that going on with 99% of the headline posts here.