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Pope Benedict XVI has acknowledged that the Vatican’s teaching against birth control was difficult – as he praised a 1968 Church document that condemned contraception.
In a speech marking the 40th anniversary of the document, Benedict reiterated the Church’s ban against artificial birth control as well as more recent teaching against using artificial procreation methods…
“No mechanical technique can substitute the act of love that two married people exchange as a sign of a greater mystery,” Benedict said in his speech.
“Forty years after its publication, that teaching not only shows itself to be unchanged in its truth, but it reveals the farsightedness with which the problem was tackled,” the pope said.
Next month, the Vatican is issuing a document supporting teachings that virgin birth and celibacy are as important, today, as CPM/Basic and Wordstar.
#49 – Mr. Hot Dog Condiment – >>Prove to me that there is a God and I’ll rest my case.
Prove to me that there’s not, Mr. Cough Syrup, and I’ll rest mine.
I’m not the one who makes the claim… you are. I’m just asking for one specific miracle or something that can hold water. Come on… you can do it… and you can also collect one million dollar!
#55 – bobbo – I used to work with a psychiatrist who was a devout Catholic. I asked him one day what the exact difference was between being religious and being crazy. He just shook his head and walked away.
LOL
Mustard, I assure you – I have underwear older than you are. You need to lighten up, take a joke and don’t get your panties in such a wad. And read #53 carefully.
#59–julieb==one con to posting under the same name all the time (easy to do if desired?) is that people and their opinions/positions get pigeon holed/typecast/made the subject of ad hominem arguments.
Take Mustard for instance. He and I have argued the nature of his all loving god enough that neither one of us engages the other on that topic. Maybe with a new name, either one of us could be coaxed into another version of that fruitless exercise and by accident discover something new about our own positions?
IOW–constant nicks tend to tamp down the number and quality of exchanges.
To your points, I don’t know how transparency or honesty even enter into the conversation as each entry should stand or fall on its own merits??????
#63,
I don’t think I’m buying that argument bobbo. I don’t like to misrepresent myself even though we have a high degree of anonymity here.
This Dope is just too stupid for words. First he says that native Americans were silently longing to be killed and enslaved.
Now he’s saying that it’s OK for the world population to continue to increase. I may have the exact number of years wrong. However, I seem to remember 5,000 years as the amount of time at current rate of population growth for the mass humans to equal the mass of Earth.
Clearly this is a physical impossibility. Adjustments in the rate of growth would change the number of years. However, any population increase will, if sustained, result in the mass of humans exceeding that of the planet.
Therefore, population growth is, by definition, unsustainable.
Further, nations with higher population growth, the U.S. excepted for the moment, are far worse off economically. AFAIK, cause and effect exists in both directions. As people’s economic status improves, birth rates drop. As birth rates increase, economic status decreases.
So, by advocating increased birth rates, the Dope is advocating poverty and starvation.
What a moran!!
I question the “no mechanical technique…”
mmmmmm
“I used to work with a psychiatrist who was a devout Catholic. I asked him one day what the exact difference was between being religious and being crazy. He just shook his head and walked away.”
And I suppose you saw this as some kind of victory for yourself? Perhaps he’s simply smart enough to know it would be a waste of time to argue with someone whose mind is closed to the possibility of God. I would have reacted the same way and I certainly wouldn’t have felt that you got the best of me.
“I have absolutely NO doubt whatsoever that God is really Satan in disguise.
I fart in His face.
I piss on the Pope’s head.
I wipe my ass on all religion.
I fuck with great joy every chance I get.”
The level of anger here toward people of faith is just stunning. I really don’t see a lot of difference between the rhetoric at this blog and what one would find at Neo-Nazi or KKK site. It’s THAT bad as far as I’m concerned.
I mean, what the hell IS this place and why are you people so damned full of hate?
This is definitely not what you wanna find when you decide to visit some tech writers blog.
Very scary.
If the Pope doesn’t play the game, he shouldn’t make the rules.
I’m a Catholic, and even I find a lot of the dogma that’s held onto to be outdated and out of whack with common sense. But then again, it’s religion. It doesn’t have to make sense.
#68 – If you could indulge me in a few questions, I’d appreciate it.
How long have you been associated with this cult?
If it was since childhood, did several of the priests have there way with you? Do they still?
Was there a “glory hole” in the confessional? A tissue roll?
How much money have you been suckered out of, er, donated to this cult?
When did you finally realize that religion doesn’t make sense?
Except for the sex, why do you still go?
#60
> Tens of billions of people have
> believed in a higher power
Indeed. If we take every human that has every lived, I suspect that the vast majority believed that trees contained spirits and I suspect that most believed in some form of astrology.
The flaw in your argument is assuming that the count of adherents somehow has a bearing on the validity of a claim. How many people believe in the unsubstantiated existence of this being is irrelevant to the proof of its existence or even the definition of what “it” is.
Just as we should be accepting of children that affirm belief in Santa Claus, so too should we continue to be accepting of adults that believe is similar fantasies. Accepting in this context does not mean complete acquiescence but rather that we tolerate their delusions to the degree that they do not impact logical decision making.
#64–julieb==there is nothing to buy here. You don’t have to agree that on balance the issue should be one way or the other. Do you understand what the pro’s and con’s of a position are, or once you make up your mind, the opposing positions no longer exist?
Are you misstating what you think or is your analysis this one sided on most issues?
There is NO misrepresentation going on here. There is as much humor, insight, information, in a topic chosen name as in keeping a constant moniker. I’d go on, but why bother if there is only one side?
#67–ramone==just the opposite. I thought I had lost. You see, real life is not like a blog. While knowing I was on thin ice, who better to ask about the sanity of religionists except a Catholic psychiatrist? Saying nothing to me and walking away meant no discussion, no insight, no benefit===I lost. I took it to mean he had been asked that question so often that he was tired of answering it. For me, it was “the first time” just as when I told him I had just heard a funny joke that “Denial is not just a river in Egypt.” Seems he had heard that one before, but he chortled a bit.
Later on, we did have a few conversations as I would email him some “anti-psychiatry” articles from “Sachs” a critic who claims there was no such thing as mental illness but rather it was all social control.
The good doctor told me that religion was no different than any other belief systems. It could be normal/functional or abnormal/dysfunctional. I could tell he didn’t want to discuss it.
What I find interesting is that intelligent religious people really don’t want to discuss their faith in depth beyond saying “they believe.” I don’t know if they are that tired, cognitively dissonant, or getting an incoming message from god.
Idiots of course are happy to talk non-stop.
#26, Mister Ketchup,
I believe in God, otherwise I’d have no one to talk to while I’m getting a blow job.
Ya, but I don’t talk with my mouth full.
>>I mean, what the hell IS this place and why
>>are you people so damned full of hate?
Good question.
>>I don’t know if they are that tired,
>>cognitively dissonant, or getting an
>>incoming message from god.
More likely, Bobster, intelligent religious people simply recognize a closed mind when they see one, and choose not to bang their heads against that wall? After all, most religious people aren’t evangelical proselytizers trying to change others’ minds. You believe what you believe, I believe what I believe, so what’s the point?
I’m with Mr. Ramone. The level of anger and hatred exhibited by some posters when it comes to spiritual matters IS astounding. No wonder he wants to be sedated http://tinyurl.com/2n5oj
#75–MM==the argument arises when religious types try (constantly) to enforce their moral values on others and deny progress across the board.
This thread for instance. Don’t the majority of American Catholics practice birth control? But the Church won’t give up trying to control other people as when interfering in the Schiavo Case.
Now, YOU may think you aren’t trying to force your religious views on others but you don’t need to. Your organization does it for you.
And as I alluded, this “mystical thinking” that doesn’t make any sense (as in an all loving god creating hell for those who disagree) is like reverse athletics for the mind. It teaches too many believers to hold views contrary to any facts. This interferes with good democratic progress.
Recognizing a closed mind? hah, hah.
>>Your organization does it for you.
Don’t presume to know what “my organization” does, Mr. Bobbolina. If “my organization” did any such thing, it would not be “my organization”, it would be somebody else’s organization. Like the Roman Catholic church, or the fLDS.
My organization is a kinder, gentler organization that promotes introspection, tolerance, prayer, civil rights, acceptance of others’ viewpoints and beliefs and like that. We’re more likely to be building Habitat for Humanity houses or working in the local soup kitchen than trying to fuck up Terry Schiavo’s right to die with dignity.
Your (and others’) continued insistence on portraying all believers as flakes who prop a dead woman up on the shitter, or who ceaselessly meddle in others’ lives, is not congruent with open-mindedness.
Tsk, Mr B. Tsk, tsk, tsk. I would have expected better from you.
#77–Mustard==no one should confuse being “open minded” with losing one mind. We are more similar than we are different. Like you I have rejected all other religions except yours. Then I simply applied what I learned about all those other religions, and rejected yours too. You are so close, only one more step to go.
Yep, so on many odious religious characteristics, yours may remain worthy of gods love. That does not mean that religion should not be roundly condemned just as any general characteristic cannot be condemned by reference to its exceptions.
This thread is about the Pope condemning sex and birth control. A truly evil stupid hypocritical hurtful position. What difference in analysis should it/can it possibly make that your flavor is different, if it is?
Bobbo, you talked me to death yet again.
#79–Mustard==no, you are just running away and trying to put your dishonest onus on me. Like I said, intelligent religionists tend to not want to discuss their faith in depth beyond saying “they believe.” I don’t know if they are
1- that tired,
2- cognitively dissonant, or
3- getting an incoming message from god.
Or, are you like a Muslim and its “ok” to lie to infidels?
So, scurry away===shoo! Or, when you’ve had your third “Blam” power drink, explain once how your god is worthy of being worshipped and even if so why he punishes those who choose not to, and if he doesn’t punish disbelievers, then how he is possibly relevant?
Just mustard up the courage to do it once before you run away. Save it for another thread.
Jesus, Bobster, you dearly do love to see your own words on dvorak dot org slash blog, don’t you?
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz…….
#81–Mustard–reread Post #80. For whatever reason(s)–YOU–don’t wish to discuss the details of your beliefs. That’s totally ok.
Just be honest about it. Stop blaming/criticizing me, stop dodging and weaving. Stop whining. Stand up.
#75
> More likely, Bobster, intelligent religious
> people simply recognize a closed mind
> when they
> see one, and choose not to bang their heads
> against that wall?
I suspect it is more than that. Having run into many smart people that were inexplicably religious, I have found that they do not want to go into any depth for fear of shattering an element of their psyche that they have always considered unshakable. Ironically, I have found that people with backgrounds in science are the most resistant to using the scientific method to analyze their own beliefs. They want to use scientific method to find truth in everything but themselves.
>>Having run into many smart people
>>that were inexplicably religious
No suprise, Tommie. Most smart people DO have spiritual beliefs.
As to the inexplicability of it, it’s not inexplicable to those of us who believe. Look into your soul, be introspective, and you too will find the same thing.
#84–Mustard==it is inexplicable because you REFUSE to explain it.
There is a treatment modality in curing delusional people, “the talking cure”, aka psychiatry. Now, with a pshchiatrist, the conversation can be “directed” by the skills of the therapist.
Quite a few “loopy” ideas however can be addressed by simply talking. Has to be outloud, mirrors to look into are optional as are tape recorders.
Take those “private thoughts” and give them verbal expression. Even this very small bit of actualization makes the ideas just a bit more “real” or objective so as to be better assessed. “Talk” to yourself. Crazy is a private conversation.
Tell us outloud–how do you think a god is all loving while he creates hell/judgment at the same time?
Or skip it. I’m just keying off your statement that religious belief was explicable while you so agressively avoid doing it.
#84
Newton believed in witchcraft. There are a lot of people that think that watching golf is interesting and that a roulette wheel must land on their number because the last twenty times it did not.
Even smart people can be extraordinarily dense at times and that is no more evident than smart people throwing the scientific method out the window when it applies to their beliefs so that they can keep their precious little psyche intact.
Bobbo, give it a rest, will you?
And Tommie, re: Newton – plenty of people still believe in witchcraft. Wicca, Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Zoroastrianism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Shintoism, Taoism, Jainism, Confucianism, Baha’i, they’re all just different people’s interpretation of the same thing.
#87–Mustard==quite happy to give it a rest. And I’ll do it as soon as you do.
#87
So, you are are equating your beliefs with witchcraft? How apt.
Your claim is in obvious reference to the analogy of people that can only see part of an elephant. That is a quaint notion except for the notable differences in acceptable behavior in each of the religions.
>>So, you are are equating your
>>beliefs with witchcraft?
You need to get out more, Tommie. Maybe when you get to high school, they’ll offer a course in comparative religion. If not there, college.
You’re beginning to make me ashamed for you.
Okay, I think there is one thing we call all agree one: getting stoned with the pope and having sex with him just isn’t on the menu….