Traditional Auto-de-fe
The heretics weren’t burned till after the ceremony
Jewish leaders and community groups criticised Pope Benedict XVI strongly yesterday after the head of the Roman Catholic Church formally removed restrictions on celebrating an old form of the Latin mass which includes prayers calling for the Jews to ‘be delivered from their darkness’ and converted to Catholicism.
The older rite’s prayers calling on God to ‘lift the veil from the eyes’ of the Jews and to end ‘the blindness of that people so that they may acknowledge the light of your truth, which is Christ’ – used just once a year during the Good Friday service – have sparked outrage.
The Pope also sparked bewilderment when he made no mention of anti-Semitism, or the fact that the Nazis killed millions of people because they were Jewish, in a speech last year at Auschwitz. He also failed to acknowledge that there might be some degree of collective responsibility of the German people.
I could care less how any organized superstition cares to manage their ideology. But, when their politics pander to elitism and ethnic hatred, that must be recognized and opposed. Within and without.
28,
Almost, but no pickle…
Its the Understandings that come from Searching the religions, and beliefs of the world… That comes to 1 understanding…
They all preach…”BE NICE TO EACH OTHER” and it dont take religion to DO THAT.
I see to many religions that speak Tolerance, and then Point fingers, “THEY DID IT”.
Dont condemn religion, or a persons beliefs, CONDEMN the corrupter of the BELIEF. USE his OWN, bible/Koran/budha to condemn him.
29—“HeyZeus” might be a clue?
31–Of course, that is step one. Now, how would YOU fill the vacuum?
#26, Mr. F., thank you for pointing that out for me. đ
#17, Peter, Peter, Peter… I’m terribly sorry for that gibe. I read your post until i saw– “#15: atheism is a religion.” –and since it wasn’t in quotations or italics, I thought it was your own sentiment and fair game for my smart-ass retort.
Oh, if only I had read a little farther… đ đ
#4
> LOL. Atheisim. The worst religion.
I seem to remember a Calvin and Hobbes cartoon where Calvin gives a report in class that went something like “Bats. The scourge the insect world.” Same concept. Atheism is not a relgiion. It is a lack of belief and therefore a lack of religion. The real enemy is ignorance.
> Proclaim that people shouldnât push their religion on them.
> Then go on to tell the church how they should believe.
If they keep their religion to themselves, you are right. However, the last time the Germans called for “converting” the Jews things ended up rather poorly.
#15
Sorry but you are mistaken. Religion by its very definition entails an affirmative belief in something; usually the supernatural. Atheism, by its very definition, is a LACK of belief in the supernatural. If lack of belief is a religion, then the list of relgiions is infinite (the religion that doesn’t believe in Santa Claus, the religion that doesn’t belief in the Tooth Fairy, the religion that doesn’t believe in Purple Leprechaun’s…).
“Atheism is a religion like no collecting stamps is a hobby.”
âAtheism is a religion like no collecting stamps is a hobby.â
Not quite. Atheism is a religion like Anarchy is a form of government would be a better comparison.
When it comes down to it, it’s your belief system. And just look above to see that Atheists are as fanatical as any other religion. Take this wonderful quote for example “That effort is better spent on devising and implementing a plan of universal education for children, in order to immunize the next generation from indoctrination.” This person wants to stop what they call “indoctrination”, by setting up the schools to indoctrinate atheism. How very Brave New World of them.
As a Christian, I’m not proposing indoctrinating everyone in schools. As an American I’m not even saying you have to be a Christian. Everyone has the freedom, and free well to believe how they choose. Does that mean everyone is right? HELL no, unfortunately.
My personal belief? We are all liars, thieves, blasphemers, adulterers, basically every human on earth is a sinner (see 10 commandments if you can find a copy now that the atheists have taken them all down), If you committed a crime a just judge would have to punish you (even if the Hilton’s tried to pay him off). We all are guilty, and all of us deserve to be punished. But God loved us all, and doesn’t want anyone to be apart for him. So he sent Jesus to pay our fine. Jesus died so that our sins can be forgiven and we wouldn’t be apart from God. Each and every person can accept the payment by 1) Confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord 2) Believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead.
36—Like your choice of “we”—now include me out. I am not a liar, but you say you are and there is evidence for it. Probably you are just very biased, a lie goes to far?
Anarchy: A state of lawlessness and disorder (usually resulting from a failure of government) Yea, I can see how a failure of government is a form of government.
You religious types crack me up. You are oppressed if your looney tunes are not forced on everyone else. “(see 10 commandments if you can find a copy now that the atheists have taken them all down). I am so pissed off at your blind stupidity, – – – – – – so I’ll stop.
Wow bobbo you are the first person on Earth to have never told a lie.
How many people do you have to kill to be a murderer? How many lies do you have to tell to be a liar?
As far as the dictionary definition of Anarchy. Nice debate point. Although I’m referencing the people that would spray paint the logo, and protest at events, describe themselves as Anarchists. They are actually promoting a way to govern society. Just as you are choosing a belief system.
… can we all get along?
Seriously though, I’m an atheist, but quite a few who label themselves that are as big zealots and intolerant as the fundamental Christians and Muslims that raise most atheists hackles…
I’m all for reasoned debate (such as you can have when if comes to matters of faith), but hijacking these comments needlessly and being full of personal attacks to religious types… well that’s just not cricket..
Two wrongs don’t make a right, and behaving exactly like the people you scorn doesn’t help make your point. We should be showing the foaming at the mouth fundies that we are more civilized than that… not such a great job of it going on here.
If not for them… do it for yourself.
btw – Jason? Atheism isn’t a believe system, no matter how many times you say it is.
It is the lack of a belief system. I have not found any evidence that would give me reason to believe in a god, gods, goddess, or any other supernatural being.
Am I open to that? Sure, I’d be excited by any evidence that would support them – it would be a huge intellectual event. There isn’t any though, so I will go along with the evidence and what can be logically proven.
That’s not belief, unless you consider something like math a belief system…
Jason, here is a broad definition of religion (dictionary.com):
“a set of beliefs concerning the (1)cause, (2)nature, and (3)purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as (4)the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving (5)devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a (6)moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.”
Atheism covers only the first two requirements, which are also covered by science so without the other 4 they aren’t related to religion.
2 out of 6. Now, how is atheism a religion again?
The aetheists on this blog need to know that your constant harping is getting really old. Whenever religion is brought up there are 10 aetheists ganging up on 2 believers. You know who you are. Not that I dont agree with you, its just that I am so sick of hearing the same tired old excuses for your “belief” in nothing, or you call it aetheism. There is nothing fresh or new coming out of you, from FSM to fairytales and blah, blah,blah. Fine, we get it already, now how about giving it a rest.
And the Pope needs to STFU and clean his own god damned house.
38-39==Jason, I do apologize. I was just being honest rather than dismissive and kind.
Of course I have lied, but the last time was years ago==last time I swore allegeance to the flag, one nation —- and so forth. I lied when I contributed to United Way just to keep my job. But I am not a liar. If you want to think sucking one dick makes you a queer, then that would be your definition. I say, every morning you wake up, brush your teeth (twice if needed) and you choose to be what you are for the rest of your life.
Dismiss the definition of anarchy as a debating point??? No, it was a learning experience FOR YOU! Use your same argument again, and yes indeedie–you will be a liar. Please brush your teeth twice afterwards.
Just stop painting everyone with your one world view. Stop oppressing people with your view they are all guilty of something. Put those buckets of sand from your loving god down. Atheists haven’t removed bibles from your places of worship or your home. Some of them and other interested in seperation of Church and State, and those interested in being free from religion, simply don’t want the Authority of the State and tax dollars used to promote your brand of lunacy. Gee, the bile is rising again, but I have it under control.
How can such disparite ideologies co-exist? We can’t. Freedom is incompatible with Religion. Temporary truces?–Yes. But the Pope shows the gravity of religion==as stated, the control and subjugation of all people. Nature of the beast. Dress it as you like, still a wolf.
I am NOT an atheist. I am an anti-theist. If God did exist, I would be against him. Dictator, not kind, plain and simple. Course, I’m open to explanation.
Atheism is simply a lack of formal religion. There is no way it is a religion, exactly the opposite. Children of religious parents are brainwashed from the day they are born. Children should be left alone to decide for themselves how life works.
Atheism is like cold, which is not a thing but is simply a lack of heat.
Ummm…
a) the document explicitly states that the use of the 1962 mass CANNOT be done, in the manner described, during the Triduum, which includes Good Friday.
b) this mass can, and is, said daily in most non-liberal dioceses and has been since Vatican II, It’s just now it will be said even in liberal dioceses.
I wish people could read, you can even find the document in English if your Latin is pitiful…sadly I think most lack the linguistic ability to understand anything, even in their own natural tongue…*sigh*
“I am NOT an atheist. I am an anti-theist. If God did exist, I would be against him. Dictator, not kind, plain and simple. Course, Iâm open to explanation. ”
The Antichrist?
Now that is fresh. You say if God exists you would be against him/her then define God using adjectives like dictator, based on what? Not saying I disagree, just wondering how you came to the conclusion other than the writings of a book that is so self-contradictory.
44—I think atheism is a lack of belief in a god allowing for belief in many other things. It is fundamentally different==ie, not on the same continuum.
Rethink that, and post back.
46–I agree the bible is contradictory but “by and large” the christian god created all things and made everything the way it is and rewards and punishes people for whatever you think he does? ie–a dictator. He will punish and reward people who just want to be left alone.
Now, in the 14th parallel universe, I have it on good authority that God does exist but he is not a dictator. True, hoomans there are born and live in stifling misery but when they die, those that believed it was a good test of their morals get to go to heaven for eternity. Those that think god is a worthless shit just become nothing. That god is an oppressive bastard, but not a dictator.
“How many wars have been fought in the name of atheism? How many millions of people have been killed in the name of atheism? How many bigoted, murderous, narrow-minded, ignorant atheists insist on imposing their “religion” on others? ”
Peter, have you forgotten the Communist? The atheist, that’s what a communist is, in China are actively persecuting the Falun Gong and until recently had zero tolerance for any religion. The Soviet Union outlawed all religion and sent many to gulags for re-education or just killed them. They wanted to do that to most of Europe and then the world. The Soviet Union was in Afghanistan for nearly a decade in the 80âs. Do you think they were spreading religion? Nope, it was atheism via Communism and it is the reason Bin Laden even exists.
48. Well allright then. Which parallel universe has the god who judges based solely on free will choices, good or bad.
49. bobbo- you do like playing mind games dont you.
#50, there isn’t one… at least in this universe.
49–Any atheists doing that were wrong as well. Not a strong position you stake out there.
50–A kind loving god worthy of worship would inform us of his presence now and tell us to experience it while it lasts because heaven for us all is only a breath away. Then we could judge him as to what it was all about.
51–Very much so, but I do believe most of what I post, tongue in cheek most often knowing I am a fringe thinker. BTW, not anti-christ. I would contest the devil as well, although in the theology I am aware of, I don’t see much difference between the two. Fallen angel designed to fall and what not.
Well, I tend to agree with your assumptions? At least they are outside the box.
#36
> Not quite. Atheism is a religion like Anarchy is a form of
> government would be a better comparison.
You are proving my point. Anarchy is not a form of government. It is an absence of government. Both the stamps analogy and the anarchy analogy prove my point that atheism is not a religion.
> When it comes down to it, itâs your belief system. And
No sir. It appears you do not understand the words you are using. I *lack* a belief in the supernatural due to insufficient evidence. That is not itself a belief. If you believe that lack of belief is itself belief then your interpretation of the word âbeliefâ has no meaning.
> (see 10 commandments i
Which Ten Commandments would that be since there are multiple versions?
#37
> Although Iâm referencing the people that would spray paint
> the logo, and protest at events, describe themselves as
> Anarchists. They are actually promoting a way to govern
> society. Just as you are choosing a belief system.
If they are organized in any way to protest or spray paint their agendas then they arenât anarchists! By definition, if you have organization you canât have anarchy. It is nonsensical to talk about anarchists wanting to govern society. The very concepts of âgoverningâ and âsocietyâ cannot co-exist with anarchy or true anarchists. In other words, people that claim themselves to be anarchists are not and do not understand the concept. So youâre twisting of the definition is pointless.
#42
You hear the same arguments because theists keep making the same ignorant claims. Stop making silly claims about what you think atheism is and weâll stop giving you the same reason you are wrong. It is as if you keep claiming 2+2=5 and we keep saying you are wrong and you complaining because we keep telling you the same, correct answer.
#49, Girl Friend
The atheist, thatâs what a communist is, in China are actively persecuting the Falun Gong and until recently had zero tolerance for any religion. The Soviet Union outlawed all religion and sent many to gulags for re-education or just killed them.
Not true. Both the USSR and China based their versions of communism on the supreme leader being a religious figure. That meant Lenin and later Stalin were infallible leaders, as was Mao later in China. The whole communist system was an âus against themâ struggle. To the ordinary peasant the leaders were gods.
The mass killings by all the communists was as wrong as the Inquisition’s wholesale slaughter of Jews or the Spanish wiping out the native Indians in the New World. But because it was all done in the name of communism it qualifies as religious too.
Good try though.
#49 – The atheist, thatâs what a communist is…
It’s like saying that the Turks are religious people and they massacred one million Armenians…. therefor all religious people are mass murderers.
Or we can good old Hitler… who was religious and starting a war that didn’t just end his but 72 million other people’s lives… therefor all religious folks are war mongers.
Isn’t it fun bundling?
56 – So due to the wholesale failure of athiesm under the guise of communism (not to mention the millions of lives snuffed out), you now state that they thought of their leaders as “gods” and weren’t true athiests? How convenient!
Why would the Jews convert today?
The Jews during the time of Jesus, knew him best of all and rejected him outright. Why would any Jew removed by 2000 years feel that they could know Jesus better than their ancestors.
Jews have no need for Jesus or Christianity, as well as Islam. It would be far more intelligent for others to convert to Judaism. It makes much more sense.
Jeffrey
drexpert@xemaps.com
59—Does logic have anything to do with choosing a religion? You’re right OR because they have had time to consider?
I’ve often thought “IF I had to choose a religion” it would be the Jewish one. World history teaches me they have been less evil than the others.
Course maybe its just emotional because my father did not like Jews. Seems he dated a girl whos family stopped the affair because he wasn’t Jewish, so he hates them as a reaction. Now, I hate my Dad, so I react by loving the Jews.
So much love and common sense in these decisions.