Of course, you already know this isn’t from a Republican candidate. And Hillary and Barack aren’t about to scare anyone who fears entry into the 21st Century.
New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson said Thursday that he wants Congress to repeal the military’s “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy in which gay service members are required to keep their sexual orientation private.
Richardson, who is running for president, said he doesn’t believe that homosexuality is immoral, and Congress should repeal the military’s policy. “People should not be judged based on their sexual orientation,” he said. “Throughout my entire career, I have fought for equal rights and against discrimination of any kind.”
Democratic presidential candidates Hillary Rodham Clinton and Barack Obama initially tried to sidestep the issue when asked about it this week, but both said Thursday they don’t agree that homosexuality is immoral.
Googling this after reading the article in the NEW MEXICAN gave me a shiny image of our fair-and-balanced media. The AP – as is their practice – offers newspapers a couple versions of any story.
The version featuring Richardson’s stand against discrimination showed up in 3 newspapers in my search. The version featuring Kansas’ 19th-Century politico, Sam Brownback, yammering about morality – showed up in 130 newspapers.
When “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” was passed, I thought it was a good compromise. The idea was that gays could be in the military as long as they were low-key about it.
But the homophobe yahoos in the military turned it into a witch hunt worse than before. So, it time to force the issue and stop this nonsense.
Gays are Americans. It’s that simple.
Whether you think they are immoral or you don’t like them is irrelevant. What your religion says about homosexuality matters not at all.
Gays are Americans and should have every right and responsibility like any other.
Can I ask my fellow humans (all nations have militaries, I was orginally going to say “United States Citizen’s”) what the implications of going from a 2 party military to a 4 party military? Explaination: orignially there were only men in the active military, 1 party. Now we have women, 2 parties. Adding Homosexuals makes it a 4 party (men, women, gay men, gay women).
When women were added it required seperate living, showering, latrines, (other things I am sure but am ignorant of since I havent been in the military) Now will we need 4 seperate facilities for each sex, and then each sex’s gay counterpart?
The argument of the openly gay crowd seems to be ‘No one is thinking about sex in the fox hole’ sound true, however, time spent in the fox hole is .01% of any current military persons duty time. Men generally like women, and women generally like me, I have asked around and no one seems to think men and women using the restroom and the showers togeather is a good idea.
Why would it be a good idea to sleep next to, and shower with, someone that might be secretly attracted to you in sexual ways. Is this supposed to be good for the moral of the straight people next to the gay person?
This is a favorite Republican wedge issues for election time so I’m surprised this is making a round at this time. Unless, of course, the party is desperate to get the bible thumpers, KKK and the rest of the GOP base rallied early.
#2 – When women were added it required seperate living, showering, latrines, (other things I am sure but am ignorant of since I havent been in the military) Now will we need 4 seperate facilities for each sex, and then each sex’s gay counterpart?
Why? Women are women whether or not they are gay. We seperate men’s showers from women’s for privacy… not because we are stupid enough to think men and women will have sex in the shower room.
Gay men have been mixing with straight men since the dawn of time with no problem… from high school locker rooms, to public restrooms, to guys together on business trips, and even in the military.
There is exactly one reason to seperate gay men from straight men and it is the same reason the white drinking fountains and colored drinking fountains… and if you don’t like the implication of what I’m saying… then too bad… because that is the end of the story on that.
The argument of the openly gay crowd seems to be ‘No one is thinking about sex in the fox hole’ sound true, however, time spent in the fox hole is .01% of any current military persons duty time. Men generally like women, and women generally like me, I have asked around and no one seems to think men and women using the restroom and the showers togeather is a good idea.
I don’t like using group facilities at all… But that’s just too bad for me, so I deal with it. I also work in an office with a lot of very attractive women, and I suppose if i thought about it, I would like to have a sexual relationship with some of them… but I don’t, because it isn’t professional and the advance would be unwanted. Why are you assuming gays can’t be just as professional?
Get over it.
#5 – Don’t Ask Don’t tell is good for the Military. There is NO GOOD PROFESSIONAL REASON for me to know someone’s gay persuasion.
Bullshit.
Are enlisted men, women, and officers allowed to go on dates during their time off? Are they allowed to be married? If they are married, are they required to hide the fact that the have wives or husbands?
The answers are, of course, yes they are allowed to date or be married and no they do not have to hide that. No one is fighted to wear t-shirts that say “I am gay” on them. They only thing gays are fighting for is the right not to be discriminated against for having the same kind of relationships everyone else does.
And if you would deny that right, then you are a bigot.
Three points:
1. Richardson may be the best “person” running for the Presidency.
2. The left won’t nomiate someone who doesn’t throw some gasoline on the fire from time to time. Maybe this is that move.
3. The right doesn’t fear him, and they should.
#7 – Well… I’m lost…
I know who joshua is, and he has not posted to this thread… So, are you for or against the policy? And why are you grinding an axe with joshua? I’m just confused now…
I can’t completely tell what is joshua’s words and what is yours… and I especially don’t know why it matters. I guess I’m just asking you to make it clear… what do YOU think?
I really don’t care what joshua said many moons ago.
#2
Only the sexually insecure people are affraid.
IMO there should be one shower stall, living quarters, etc. If the senior military staff fears that doing so may trigger rapes, then there’s something rotten inside the armed forces.
Don’t the gay and gay advocates know that the only reason gay people in the army don’t get kicked out is because no one knows, its not like people have gotten any more tolerant of gay people, it just seems to me that all these gay advocates of the gays in the military think that they have rights now so they shouldn’t have to keep it a secret, its just stupid i dont understand it one bit.
Noname,
I have no idea what your position or comments are. Just what are you quoting joshua and what is your commentary. Your posts #5 & 7 are way too confusing.
#8, James, Very astute points. I don’t know if I agree, but I think they are something to seriously think about.
I’d be a lot happier if the policy was “no ask, no TELL” regarding religious convictions. But since that isn’t going to happen….I see no purpose for people who identify as gay/lesbian need to say silent on anything, or be treated any differently. It’s really no big deal.
As for all you spineless weenies (like poster #2) who think you’re so damn hot that every gay dude won’t be able to keep their hands off you I have one word: HA!
The reality of it is…you think too highly of yourself,
Are you that freaked out/insecure/sex-addled/insane that you’d be rendered unable to use the polite phrase “no thanks” if someone did ASK if you were “available”? Give me a break. I suppose you married the first girl who said “yes” to you?
So, let me get this straight, you can’t say NO if it involves sex? Are you that weak-willed? In that case, the problem is YOU. Get help.
If that’s the case, then I’m sure your reaction is just part of some homo-erotic fantasy that you play out, over-and-over, in your mind? Wow. How 11th grade!! Talk about arrested development.
Homosexuals are just like heteros…no difference, at all.
Damn, dude, get over your little high-school hissy fit freak out, and start seeing that people are just people.
Whatever,
I agree ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’ isn’t really a good policy. The Homo’s should instead be allowed to parade around in all their perversion.
This is about wearing T-Shift, having on-base Gay Groups, Gay parades, etc. Watch a Gay parade and either you will be disgusted or turned on, that is if you’re Gay. Gays are never willing to stop a simply not be treated as the perverts they are, in a similar vein child molestors don’t like be restricted to the closet either. Not much differance they both prey on the young and immature for their victems. But what do you expect from individuals that get off on sticking their pecker in someone else’s BM? At least if the little liberal/commies do this they should have seperate restrooms, you Male, Female, Homo.
We could recruit a brigade of Gays and send the little perverts to fight the Muslims, show them what America is all about. Of course the Dehimmis liberal/commies here in the states would go bonkers over this idea, still since most of the Gay perverts are from upper class/rich backgrounds it would be nice to see them do something other than spreading desease. Which brings up the idea of taxing Gays for their lifestyle, since it’s so prone to desease. We could call it a fudge packing license?
They should throw women into the same showers too. Surely guys will be very professional about it.
OFTLO and Mr. Fusion…..noname is trying to make me understand that he is a black person, so when I said he was just like those who didn’t like blacks, asians, mexicans, only now it’s gays they hate…and those people were bigots.
What he dosen’t get is that being black dosen’t make you immune from being a bigot. And noname IS a bigot.
Traax….my God your a total sleeze. I’m pro-life, but if I knew you were about to be born….I would have you aborted.
I was wondering about Richardson myself a couple of weeks ago. I have this theory that the media created Obama to give Hillary a run for her money, and that the media will turn on both of them around Dec. 2007 or Jan. 2008 and that there needs to be someone besides Gore to pick up the mantle. So, I was looking for more info on Richardson, fairly successful Governor, gormer Ambassador to the UN….former Clinton cabinet member……and…Hispanic. Comes across as moderate. This is a good move on his part, especially after Obama and Hillary were slow on the uptake this week. And Edwards was a bit slow at first as well.
I think James Hill has a very good point to make in his 3 points.
I’ll say it again:
If homosexuals are Americans… then they should have all rights of Americans.
What you personally think about them or what your religion says about them matters not one diddly.
#17 – Yes… it is all becoming clear 🙂 By the way…
I think James Hill has a very good point to make in his 3 points.
That is a nice line 🙂
#18 – You (Joshua) calling me a bigot is rich.
What about when I do it? Is it still rich then too?
Who gives a damn about your endless prattle that there is no professional reason for people to know someone is gay? Okay already… That’s true. Conversely, there is no professional reason for people to know you are straight either… Further, there is no professional reason one needs to take steps to hide their orientation either.
If a male officer can be honored at a banquet with his wife at his side… If a returning enlisted woman can be photographed with her husband… why cannot a gay serviceman be afforded the same dignity? No one is fighting for a “special” right. The gay community simply wants the same rights that you and I have. And the only reason to deny them that right is bigotry.
You sir, are a bigot.
Richardson is taking this stand, and he’s willing to cut taxes while Obama and Hillary are about equal on all issues. Plus Richardson has more experience than the top three contenders combined. We may have to move him ot the front tier. He even has the exaggeration of his life story and possible womanizing/sexual harassment which seems to be a requirement for the Democrats.
On the other hand… The US Army is loaded with bible thumping white supremacist sexist bigots, let them go to war and be killed ’cause that would mean one less bigot to deal with.
#22,
LET THE PEOPLE ACTUALLY SERVING VOTE
Damn !!! If anyone still thinks you have a point, they must be looking at the top of your head. Put your hat on so people don’t see your pointy little head.
The Military serves the American public. That does not make any one in the military special or worthy of deferential treatment. It doesn’t make anyone in the military more of an American then any civilian. To decide that only military personnel are worthy of a vote is traitorous and if from someone in the military, they should be Court Martialed. To deny anyone a vote should be treated as treason.
I found the scariest point of your post to be when you called OFTLO Dear. Geeze, what a hypocrite. Addressing a man with with the familiar affectionate usually used for someone of the opposite sex or partner. And while most of us use the acronym of his handle, you honored him by writing the whole handle out. Damn, how can you spout such hatred towards gays then turn around and get all sweety face with OFTLO?
So I give. Are you a gay basher or just secretly in the closet until you retire from the military?
Homosexuality poses substantial health risk.
Males homosexuals make up 2.8% of the population.
Females homosexuals make up 1.4% of the population.
Homosexual males account for 30% of all AIDS cases (0.1% of entire adult population is infected with HIV (1 in 1000); incidence of AIDS among 20-30 year old homosexual men is roughly 430 times greater than among heterosexuals at large)
Risk of contracting HIV from random heterosexual intercourse is roughly 1 in 716,000; between male homosexuals age 20-30 it is 1 in 164
Homosexuals are disproportionately vulnerable to Hepatitis B, Amebiasis, Campylobacteriosis, Chlamydm trachomatis, Giarda lamblia infection, Herpes, Human papilloma viruses or HPV, Neisseria gonorrhoeae, Shigellosis, Treponeama pallidurn, Chronic, potentially fatal, liver disease (mfectious Hepatitis) which increases risk of liver cancer
Pedophilia is three times more common among homosexuals than heterosexuals.
Homosexuals are fifteen times more likely to committee suicide.
Homosexuals without AIDS and with a long-term partner had a life span 3 decades shorter than married men.
8, 13 – Odd to see you two more or less in agreement. Odder yet to agree with both of you at the same time.
Richardson has a real-world, non-True-Believer-In-Chief (nod to Newsweek magazine) appeal going for him.. Judging solely by his performance in New Mexico, Richardson may also be the best qualified to start what I believe will be a generations-long effort to repair the damage the Bushies have done. (I see the alternative as a faster slide into a system with two economic classes and no liberty for anyone but the wealthiest 1%.) He demonstrably pulls divided political outlooks together meaning he’s a potential genuine “uniter, not a divider.” Most of all, though, he’s an effective executive, and God knows the U.S. desperately needs that right now. Plus, he’s actually fluent in two languages rather than none.
I’m wondering if he “threw gasoline on the fire,” as James Hill put it, so Rove and his clones couldn’t blindside him with the issue three weeks before the election. Gives people time to digest what he said and maybe have a rational, not emotional and not manipulated, response to it.
Richardson says what he means, apparently. I used to think John McCain did, and was willing to forgive many of the disagreements I had with him simply because of his integrity. Then he started flip-flopping on issues like Bushies on the importance of catching Osama, and another political fantasy balloon deflated with the sound of wet gas escaping.
Still watching Richardson. So far he seems to be the genuine article. And wouldn’t that be great to have for a change?
Richardson isn’t perfect, but he’s better than any other person running for the Presidency, on either side. Giuliani is probably in second place. If the campaign goes the way I want it to, I’d like the two of them running against each other, and actually talking about real issues instead of non-issues that popped up in the last two elections. One can hope.
I’m all for integration, but since there are so many reactionaries out there, maybe they could begin by doing what they did with black people in the early days: Have separate groups in the military, exclusively for gays. I’m guessing they would do exactly what the blacks did: Kick Arse. I’ve heard that the French Foreign Legion is mostly gay, and if you’ve ever met any of them, you know they are not to be messed with.
28 – Maybe as an option to “don’t ask, don’t tell”? Gays who want to leave their preference out of their public life, don’t talk about it; gays who want to be public so they can be photographed with their partners or whatever, volunteer for the gay unit?
Might be a good first step, as you say. Interesting idea. Of course it would still be a step from one type of bigotry directly into another. I bet you’re right, though. With so much to prove, I bet – like Japanese-Americans serving in WWII – they would be incredibly determined and effective in combat.
#30 – Jesus H Fucking Christ on a pogo stick…
You could make a Klansman ashamed.
Dear OhForTheLoveOf , I’ve never had the mind to hang out with Klansman ( I am Black).
I will have to take your word as the authority for what makes a Klansman ashamed, you Bigot.
#32, Well, you could start a Black Chapter of the KKK.
PS, I’m in Indiana.
PSS. Aren’t the seals those guys who never leave their buddies behind?
#33
They also give a new meaning to turning the other cheek.
#34, Has anyone mentioned lately, You’re a bad boy !!!