Techniques perfected by the renowned British hangman Albert Pierrepoint were said to have been studied by the Iraqi executioners. If that is so, then the most prolific British executioner of the 20th century would have been horrified by the decapitation of Barzan al-Tikriti.
Most important was the art of judging the “drop” — the length of rope required to kill the condemned as quickly and painlessly as possible. Too long and the force of the fall would decapitate the prisoner — as happened in Baghdad — too short and it would slowly strangle him.
Mr Pierrepoint carefully recorded the height and weight of those to be executed in a series of log books. The length of drop was calculated using the 1913 Official Government Table of Drops.
During his 25-year career, first as assistant and later chief hangman, he dispatched 433 men and 17 women.
After resigning in 1956 Pierrepoint wrote: “Capital punishment in my view achieved nothing except revenge.”
Is revenge good enough reason?
#31, so you’re volunteering to make the call who has led a life-worthy life and who hasn’t? Welcome to the club Mr. Hitler!
This is unbelievable. Where have you been the last 200 years?
pj
#33, You have invoked Godwin’s Law.
Interesting, though. Can no one disagree with your opinion without them being compared to Hitler? It must be very nice to see the world in such black and white terms, but I prefer to not wear the blinkers.
Excuse me, #34, but am I seeing things black and white?
Because I say there’s shades of grey in how worth while a life has been led and invite Mr. economic argument to make the call on every single person and never to miss any judgement?
I am black and white in one sense: noone has the right to take another person’s life, for no reason other than immidate self-defence.
Now here’s someone who wants to take lifes for the reason that teir economic benefit to the society is less than the economic cost, and you call me black and white?
This is not about my view of the world, this is about the deeply flawed argument that the value of a human life can be measured by economical standards. So how much is your economical value today?
I am German. We have have had a government that made this point of view a reality. I’m pretty happy it’s no longer our government today.
I might turn red and purple when I hear someone proposing this again, but I’m pretty sure it’s not me who is looking at things black and white.
pj
35 and related posts, Peter, yes, you are seeing it in ‘black and white’. “Death penalty is always wrong’. Not much argument there and it can’t get much plainer than that.
What I disagree is with the “always” part.
I’m not going to go into sidetrack discussions of ‘economic value’ or ‘whose life is worth more’. Those are, to me, completely irrelevent.
My only issue is this: is the death penalty ever justified? If the answer is ‘yes’ (which is what I believe), then the next question must be ‘under what circumstances’?
Also where I take issue with your comments, is your implication that if only we had the benefit of YOUR ideas, we’d come around to the right way of thinking. (examples: #19 – first paragraph. #32 second sentence).
You have also missed a historical fact (ref #19 – “Basically, in the earliest of days it was “you kill one of mine, I kill one of yours” that’s not practiced in many modern societies anymore today.”)
Ever hear of ‘blood price’? The basic concept of that was “You’ve killed one of mine; you owe me either a life or restitution.”
Pagan concept, gradually eliminated as the rule of law took over and the needs of society began to overrule the needs of the individual.
So you see, human life has always had some economic value, but the value was in the life of the *victim*. The convicted killer then had a choice: forfeit their own life OR pay the blood price.
So there’s the distinction that gets glossed over in the pro- and anti-death penalty argument. Saddam’s victims get no restitution, get no ‘blood price’.
And as for your question about *my* economic value, well, that’s 2 years salary if I keel over tomorrow. Ever hear of life insurance? Every day, people put a value on their lives, purely on monetary merits.
—
And to finish off, a purely personal question. How old are you? I’ve heard that most Germans of the post-war era have never been taught much about WW2. Is that true and, if so, did you have to use your own resources to learn about the past?
I, for one, don’t give a rat’s ass that they botched this monster’s hanging. He died a quick death anyhow… which is more than can be said of his victims.
#38 Peter,
That does answer the question, thank you. As for where I got this from, various (fiction) books and various television interviews/documentaries I’ve seen. The general tone of the documentaries in particular was that Germans were kept in the dark about Nazi-era activities. Living in denial, if you will.
Looking back, and comparing that with what you’ve said, it becomes obvious that the documentaries had a particular axe to grind. What’s less obvious is, if the viewer is personally unfamiliar with any of the events, the ideas presented become ‘true’ (cf. Disney’s suicidal lemmings). In my case, they become ‘conditionally true’. i.e. I accept it for the moment.
On this side of the pond, in high school, Canadian history (circa 1970) ended in 1757 at the Plains of Abraham (the battle where British forces defeated the Frence, and New France became British North America). After that, nada. Anything later, I had to find out for myself and am still learning.
Thanks for the link. I *will* read it, but I’ll tell you up front: I have always found Nietzsche to be very dense reading. (University philosopy courses – we didn’t get along. 8) )