Copy-protection features in Windows Vista make the operating system more bloated while giving few benefits to end users, according to a new security paper.
Peter Gutmann, a medical imaging specialist, argues in the paper that Microsoft’s cumbersome approach to DRM is doomed to fail and will only succeed in pushing users towards buying faster hardware to cope with degraded performance, effectively imposing collateral damage on the rest of the industry.
Many of the criticisms Gutmann makes will be familiar to those who have followed the development of Vista’s copyright protection features however his hard-hitting prose style and warning that the Vista Content Protection specs could “very well constitute the longest suicide note in history” has reinvigorated the debate.
Microsoft is risking annoying its customer base and users in a bid to corner the market for home distribution of premium content.
Phew! I’m glad that I’m not one of those waiting for this contribution to “innovative” computing.
I’d agree with the conclusion except for one thing. People aren’t making OS decisions based on cost, performance or ease of use. In fact logic and reason rarely seem to enter into it. If it did Windows would have died at 3.1.
I think its just you Cali people that just don’t get it. I don’t want to live in an Apple sandbox of nice toys and what not. I need defacto standards. DUH ! There is nothing wrong with copy protection and I say bring it on. The rest of the world needs it, why are you crybabies trying to ruin all the fun ?
By the way…I had thought that there were a lot of homeless people looking for a job in silicon valley, anyways. You should be grateful Microsoft decided to give IT people MORE jobs.
#3 – You don’t live in an Apple sandbox – OS X is only about 5% of the computer market. Don’t let the fancy little Apple Store in your area freak you out.
People are going to continue to buy windows because it is installed on just about every computer you buy. Only computer geeks understand bloatware and DRM, the rest of society could care less or just doesn’t get it. The majority of the world is happy their computer turns on and can get on the internet, not the priviledge of being able to run aero glass.
Only computer geeks understand bloatware and DRM, the rest of society could care less or just doesn’t get it. The majority of the world is happy their computer turns on and can get on the internet.
I’ve been saying this for years. Why do you think viruses, spyware and spam are so prevalent, stupid users. People buy brands (HP, Dell, ect) not OSs. Whatever happens to be preinstalled is what they use, how else do you think M$ became #1, a superior product?
This will also hurt M$ as very few will be running out to buy Vista. They will only use when it comes preinstalled on their shinny new Dell.
DRM gives no benefits to users.
Vista is going to cause MS plenty of headaches.
The DRM is going to get cracked. WGA and activation are already on their way of getting cracked, and it still hasn’t been officially released. Cracking the system to run unsigned drivers will occur at some point, thereby blowing all that content protection out the Windows. (pun intended?)
People aren’t making OS decisions based on cost, performance or ease of use. In fact logic and reason rarely seem to enter into it. If it did Windows would have died at 3.1.
This isn’t true anymore. I may have been true back then, but now we have a whole generation born and are getting into the workforce that ARE computer savvy. More and more in the news…the regular news…we hear of rootkits and virus attacks and we hear how good one OS is compared to a bad OS. For instance, when OSX Tiger shipped, it made front page news in this little small-town newspaper near me…the one only old people read to see who died basically. Yet there was OSX featured talking about how easy and powerful it was.
When the Sony rootkit fiasco hit, it wasn’t just geeks talking about it, the old-folk radio station in Chicago (WGN in case you wanted to know) were talking about it on just about every show…only a few days after it hit. People were calling in and telling how they were infected with it etc etc. I remember at the time the message boards were saying that “the average Joe isn’t going to care about this at all”….but they did, in a big way.
The old idea that only geeks are computer savvy is over. Sure, there’s always non-savvy people in the world that will never just “get it”. For instance, look how long cars have been around and I’m totally clueless about them other than I know to get the oil changed and other basic maintenance.
“…will only succeed in pushing users towards buying faster hardware to cope with degraded performance, effectively imposing collateral damage on the rest of the industry.”
How does making people buy faster computers impose collateral damage to the rest of the industry?
It seems to me that people buying new computers would be a good thing for the industry. Now consumers, that’s a different matter.
“DRM is doomed to fail and will only succeed in pushing users towards buying faster hardware to cope with degraded performance,”
DUH! M$ needed to find a way to slow down computers, thus forcing the consumers to buy faster computers.
That has always been the M$ strategy.
Just because the 5% that makes up the OS X user base is doing it better than you is no reason to get pissy.
Considering how closed Itunes and the Ipod are (and I own both), I think a good arguement could be made that Apple is not doing it any better…
Tom
>>> Just because the 5% that makes up the OS X user base is doing it better than you is no reason to get pissy.
Well, Hasta la Vista… my next OS will be Linux. I couldn’t care less about the MS bells and whistles… and of course their DRM. Everything I do on my current Windows 2000 installation can also be done on Linux. I’m doing less and less gaming, so that’s no issue anymore.
Jägermeister, that’s a great turn of phrase — “Hasta la Vista.”
It’s “goodbye,” but with the optimism for a possible future meeting. Perhaps a future version of Windows will be more satisfying, but for now, I’ll just politely say “no thanks” and wave goodbye. 😉
#14
I’m not sure if MS will dump the BS in the future. After all, they’ve spent so much time and money on it. If they do, it’s probably far into the future (in technology time), and I might not want to change back. 😉
I think the guy who wrote the original aricle is full of crap. Wana know why??? Most everything on Peter Gutmanns website is wrong.
Most noteably, he also wrote this:
Feminism in Network Security
Network security and feminism go hand-in-hand
• Problems of traditional male-dominated computer security
• Modern feminism provides an alternative approach
Holistic approach to network security issues
• Applying feminist theory to security problems
• An egalitarian attitude towards solution providers
The “Jesus as Mother” figure in postmodern feminist
theology and its application to securing networks
• Problems of subordination of women in traditional
testosterone-poisoned network environments
• Sexual identity issues in digital signature mechanisms
#2 – I’d agree with the conclusion except for one thing. People aren’t making OS decisions based on cost, performance or ease of use. In fact logic and reason rarely seem to enter into it. If it did Windows would have died at 3.1.
Comment by Blues — 12/28/2006 @ 3:04 am
Here is an echo of the BS that floats around and obscures the issue… Platform zealotry is not a substitute for a reasoned response. That people choose differently than you doesn’t mean people choose without considering cost, performance, or anything else.
Windows works and it works well.
In my opinion, Macs are cute. They do okay with photo and video apps and they are nice Internet appliances despite the most unintuitive OS imaginable. In the days of Win 3.1 and NT, Mac OS was a toy. But Macs are not powerful and they do not game…
More important than that, however, is the enterprise sector where the big boys play and develop apps for use across multiple thousands of desktops in geographically disparate locations. MS is the best choice, period.
What you guys use at home is irrelevant. Use a Mac, use Linux, hell, use a damn Amiga for all anyone cares… But no one can touch Microsoft in the Enterprise space for reliability, extensibility, and stability… all the ilities are covered.
Not only that, but Windows is gracious enough to allow a few Macs onto the network for the poor myopic non-nerds in the Marketing department so they can keep believing they have the best tool for making web sites and pretty graphics.
Yes… I am biased… Just like poster #2
The difference is, I’m also right.
#12 – Just because the system is closed doesn’t mean it isn’t the best: It just means it will have a harder time staying the best and reacting to the market long term.
OK, Think PLZ..
windows is 90% security…thats ALL you get, is protection form this, that and the other.
If you have TV/video Output, TRY to display a DVD video onto the TV…
It wont work..Because its IN THE CODEC, not to make it work.
ALL this DRM, and Included scripts in Everything form Pic, movies to Software, only gives Avenue/ability of hackers to PUT CRAP on your machines.
When GIF pic format gained the ability to hide exeecutable scripts inside the pic, to monitor WHOM was viewing the pic on the net, that opened the doors. And MS took this and made it work even better, and from ALMOST everything.
Those running FF, and NoScript, can tell you…I have seem upto 200 forbidden scripts from 1 site and ALL the adverts.
Its a STUPID backdoor..
I said before and say again, that security on DVD’s adds a good $3-5 per DVD.. And they Complain because people HACK those to resell at cheaper prices… If they would drop DVD prices to $12-15 for NEW, and dump the security…There PROBABLY WOULDNT be much hacking and resale. Its not worth the price or cost..
I would REALLy like to know, how big windows would be, and HOW fast, if all this DRM, Codec protections, included scripts, and other crap was Dumped…
Its all extra processing that slows everything down.
If you are going to show a pic, SHOW the pic and dont worry about the protection, dont RUN the protections, DONT care about the protection.
How well, fast, would a DVD play without ALL this protection if it wasnt checked for and executed.
HOW fast would the Net run if ALL the background CRAP and hidden scripts were NOT run/used.
HOW easy it would be to Protect the system from Virus if we didnt Worry about the hidden STUFF running around the net.
Given that Gutmann is a Ph.D in Computer Science, virtually all of his site is about topics like, “Certificate Management as Transaction Processing”. Boring, perhaps; but, rarely as spicy as the single article which GregA took and presented — subheadings and all — as if they were a grand and representative series of articles.
None of which I don’t doubt GregA ever took the time to read. Perhaps that’s a skill above the ranks of M$oft fanboys.
ECA,
If you dont like the HDMI features that will be in Vista, don’t use them. Simple. Use plain old DVD’s to your hearts content. HD-DVD and Blue Ray are still for early adopters, and HDTV is DOA anyhow.
If you use a service like Gmail, or any other reasonably secure email provider, AND (this is a big and) you don’t get your software from thepiratebay.org, you simply don’t need a virus checker anymore. Anyhow, get rid of Norton, and get a different one, just about every virus checker I have looked at works better than the Norton thing that came with your computer.
Finally, well written games run better on Vista than they do on XP. Oblivion, which stuck to MS rules for coding run better. Games like city of heros, which mixed directx and opengl calls run a little bit slower.
All in all, if you purchased a computer in the last year it will run Vista just fine, unless you were especially gimpy on the video card. If you have an AGP interface or a PCIe slot, go out and get yourself a $60 video card, and AERO will run just fine.
98% of everything that has been said about Vista is unadulterated FUD. And, Vista already (not even in conusmer release yet) has a greater market share than OS X and Linux on Desktop combined. It is on track to be the most spectacularly uneventful major operating system release in history.
By the end of 07′, Linux on desktop will be a fading memory, and Aqua, will have lost the little bit of lustre it held over XP. Look for Apple to cease production of desktop computers, and become purely a gadget, and web browser applicance company(which they are now anyhow, and supporters will argue that what they always were so quit SAYING THAT!).
Apple will be unable to provide a HDMI interface in OS X(kernel is opensource and they lack the license to change that), so no protected HD video on Mac computers.
No one will notice Apples silent death(which has already happened). iTimeMachine will not be enough to save the OS X operating system.
HDTV is DOA anyhow.
No one will notice Apples silent death(which has already happened).
Not that we needed any more proof that you don’t know what you’re talking about, but thanks.
#20 – I would REALLy like to know, how big windows would be, and HOW fast, if all this DRM, Codec protections, included scripts, and other crap was Dumped…
About the same size as it is now.
#24 – Agreed. They’d feel obligated to replace it with more bloat.
22,
And you run XP…
Im sorry.
I STOPPED, on win2000…
Its SOLID, and I can ADD anything i wish, even THOSE fun codecs i wish XP had. I can Play videos to my TV…you probably CANT.
#27 – People do a lot more things on a computer than play games. If you like gaming & don’t care about people giving you the great privilege to run their OS on your computer, then by all means go buy a PS3 or an Xbox and leave us computer users alone. Go play yourself (big difference with go play with yourself, which I didn’t write) and leave grown-ups work.
First off… I am a grown up professional and a gamer. I don’t play with toys. Games are serious business and they require serious hardware. If you bring your kids over, I’ll drag out an Xbox for them, but real gaming is done on a PC.
And you might want to check out the demographics on gaming, and the revenue generated by the gaming industry before you decide that gaming is kid stuff.
I do take great deal of importance is someone wants to tell me how should I use the hardware I bought. If they don’t want me running their stuff great, stuff your stuff.
Dude… I have no idea what that says in any language….
pedro might be using babelfish
Welcome to VistaME.
To the Apple fans…
I’ve used and still use Apples from the IIe days. In fact, my IIe is STILL more reliable than any other computer I’ve ever owned. Of course, it only runs one thing at a time, so it’s understandable. But, one thing Apple does to everyone but rarely do they victims like to admit it is force obsolecense on you. Yes, they could have made the IIgs better, but that would have hurt the Mac and Steve Jobs. And Steve don’t like to be hurt. He’s an orphan after all…
Anyhoo… One thing MS did was support everything that was thrown at them. Crappy PC’s, drivers and the rest were all part of the package. So, when comparing MS to Apple, why not compare boutique PCs? Say a Voodoo or Area 51 or a real high end manufacturer? It’s unfortunate that MS doesn’t get to choose who get’s compared to Apple, but thems the breaks.
Since Windows 98se, I’ve found that I’m more comfortable knowing what’s wrong with my PC than what’s wrong with my Mac. Figuring out what’s going on with the Mac has come to three steps… Permission repair, disk repair, reinstall. In the Windows world, I’m able to uninstall and reinstall system components. Solves 99% of my problems. As for OSX, I’m not getting into text file editing and that shit. If I wanted to do that, I’d use Linux.
As we say in the hood here… You get what you pay for… and if your KNOW what you’re paying for, you get even more.
FYI… in the new year, I resolve to post more messages in the language of ECA….
I wish Ubuntu LTS had Firefox 2 support….