Victory courtesy of the Republican machines
Jim Webb, the Democratic candidate for Senate in Virginia who leads Senator George Allen, a Republican, by about 7,000 votes, began planning his transition to the Senate Wednesday, confident that the margin would survive state scrutiny or any legal challenge, aides said.
If the Webb victory holds up, it will provide the final seat Democrats need to take control of the Senate. With Jon Tester, a Democrat, unseating Senator Conrad Burns, an incumbent Republican in Montana, the Democrats are now one seat short of a 51-49 majority.
“The bottom line is the votes have been counted and Jim Webb has won,” said Kristian Denny Todd, a Webb aide. “It could have gone the other way, but it didn’t. We’re on top and that’s the way it’s going to stay.” She said that “Senator-elect Webb” is consulting with advisers and planning to take his Senate seat in January.
All of [this] occurs in relatively uncharted legal territory where it is unclear what a recount really means in jurisdictions where there is no paper trail and where the actual number of eligible provisional ballots remains in flux.
Barring surrender by one side, it looked like a drawn-out process could extend into December.
The recount is unlikely to resolve all the potential legal issues. In Virginia, “recounts” consist of re-tabulating the votes from the existing counts to ensure that the end-of-the-day tallies were summed accurately. Virginia uses a mix of optical-scan machines and touch- screen machines, with 11 different systems in total, across more than 130 jurisdictions, amounting to more than 9,000 machines. Touch-screen machines print out full tallies after all voting is done, and unless these printouts are unclear, officials generally do not rerun the machines. With optical-scan machines, only unclear ballots are run back through the scanner.
The bottom line is that there aren’t individual receipts or ballots to be recounted. Virginia already went through this in a contested race — and after several weeks of whining about the mathematics of retabulating the results from the “approved” machines, the total was changed by 37 votes.
This chickens have really come home to roost on this one. The Bush government wasted $2.5 billion on the cheapest, low-bid, unverifiable solution to the question of voting procedures — and are suffering the result of their own handiwork.
It just feels so good saying it:)
Senate Majority Leader Hillary Clinton!
I doubt it. Doesn’t matter what kind of job she did, she would take flak just for being in the position and that would screw up her ’08 presidential campaign.
Until it’s certified in Richmond, I still worry about Diebold-Rovian doomsday recount code in a double secret ROM.
And something else that feels good saying, “chief special prosecutor for war profiteering”.
Maybe it’s just that the voters have spoken?
Where are the dittoheads and the “you liberals” comments?
I think the most unbelievable thing for me, is that people who voted had common sense, i thought after 2004 all was lost for our democracy, but things turned around. Its really amazing.
So the Democrats managed to back into taking the House and Senate. Good for them. Time to switch my investments to tax exempt municipal bonds…
Don’t know anything about the Market either, eh, Thomas?
Sometime, in your spare time, check back on how the Market has done in the past half-century after Dems get elected. Uh, especially the Clinton years.
#5, give it time, James Hill is trolling about. I expect him shortly. Actually, as OFTLO mentioned the other day, I enjoy his comments. Not for the insight or brilliance; more for the audacity.
What are you suggesting with the headline? That Allen was the real winner, but lost because of Democrat vote fraud?
I have lots of experience with election recounts. Even with paper ballots, 7,000 votes is a huge lead. 37 votes “turned” sounds about right to me.
moss,
The Internet can only be invented once. We will indeed see how they do with the economy without the boom it created to save them.
(sorry if this double posts, captcha not nice to epifany browser now using firefox)
Just sharring my joy at voting for a winner this time (Claire McCaskill Mo.)
Why, Thomas — you must be younger than I thought. C’mon — use this Interweb to do some research. You can find pretty accurate numbers. Wall Street may have a lot of greedy fools on board; but, they keep good records.
I think you’ll find the Peace Dividend meant a lot more than any bubble.
moss,
> Wall Street may have a lot of greedy fools on board;
> but, they keep good records.
I guess Wall Street is only for the rich and/or greedy? Quite the economist you are. I must be old because I remember a time when Democrats actually cared about the middle class. Here’s to hoping that this new crop elected folks are more moderate and less like their party’s fringe (Actually, I wish the same towards any elected official regardless of party)
> I think you’ll find the Peace Dividend meant a
> lot more than any bubble.
Riiiight…As long as we count the fallout from your “Peace Dividend”, whatever that is, in the grand accounting of its presumed benefit…
Bill Clinton’s first two years weren’t that great with the tax increase and new regulations. Lots of people were talking about a ‘double dip’ recession. Once Republicans took over Congress and sent the word that they would be a brake on the Democrats, things started soaring. Capital gains tax cut in 1997 sent things further along. I don’t think the Democrats can do too much damage in the short term, since their majority is relatively narrow, and the tax cuts have been extended.
“This chickens have really come home to roost on this one”
What does this even mean?
This post obviously didn’t have much thought put into it. Just yet another act of sensationalism.
At least a few of the dittoheads showed up — the folks who consider party loyalty more important than issues. The neocon nutcases in charge could put out PR today — saying the sun will rise from Rove’s butt, tomorrow, in the south — and a few goobers would show up saying it didn’t happen in the past because Clinton opposed it. Or Truman. Or Roosevelt.
Whatever — the issues, cause and effect relationships are ignored because the ideology says different.
Apparently, most folks get it. If no one else is up at this hour, I’ll try to clarify why the folks at the Trib wrote the article.
1. The Bush Brigade “resolved” voting problems by putting systems into place without accountability. No paper trail kept the price down — and everyone here knows the cheapest computing systems are always the best, right? Leaving out a component doesn’t matter.
2. They dragged their feet at every bump — why would a government founded on no accountability or responsibility wish to implement verification — just because voters wanted it?
3. They forgot that no accountability cuts both ways. At least, that’s what I would ascribe “the chickens” to.
In the Virginia election, there well have been mistakes, screwups, perhaps, foul play — but, there’s no way to trace back to the voter in the booth.
There’s still one House seat up in the air, this morning, because one state retained accountability. Perish the thought it took a Dem governor to reject the Diebold [etc.] solution — but, New Mexico went 100% back to paper ballots with OCR [real simple OCR btw] to read and collate. Every place there may be a challenge, human beings [remember those?] can review the ballots one-by-one. So, a Repub incumbent just may retain her seat — because there ain’t no chickens roosting on the polling places in that state.
Sorry to take up so much space, here; but, someone may as well explain common parlance to T.O.T..
Even when you guys win, you find some “angle” about republicans. Geez, get off the high horse. By the way, where’s all the uproar about republicans trying to steal votes? That’s all I heard for months on how they were stealing elections using the e-voting machines. Gee, I guess they were wrong. Imagine that.
By the way, where’s all the uproar about republicans trying to steal votes? That’s all I heard for months on how they were stealing elections using the e-voting machines. Gee, I guess they were wrong. Imagine that.
See, that’s the thing about evoting. Nobody KNOWS whether there is fraud, and worse, nobody CAN know. No amount of forensic investigation can determine, after the fact, whether the votes were tallied accurately or not.
This election doesn’t prove anything one way or the other. Maybe the Democrats hacked the machines, and that’s why they won. Maybe the Republicans AND the Dems hacked the machines, and cancelled each other out. And maybe the Republicans hacked them, but didn’t hack enough.
This is NOT an issue that will go away just because people who don’t understand the technology don’t belive in it.
Chuckle! What is it about “chickens coming home to roost” that apparently confounds dittoheads? Does refusal to accept accountability or responsibility necessarily flow from no perception or understanding of cause and effect relationships?
Sounds like a good topic for a joint study between Harvard Business School and the Med School.
16 I don’t think the Democrats can do too much damage in the short term, since their majority is relatively narrow, and the tax cuts have been extended.
But, on the bright side, there is less chance of any “temporary” tax cuts being made permanent.
I’m ejoying all of this post-election worship from the lefties who can’t counter any of my points. Here’s another one to chew on:
While an interesting headline, you don’t see the right crying over spilled milk… unlike the Democrats during the past three elections. No lawyers, no endless recounts, just the boss saying “we got thumped”.
Why is this the reaction? Because while I personally detest it, the ’08 election races started yesterday… and the right’s current tone already has them in the lead. I’d love to say it’s all about ‘class’, but realistically its all about votes… and driving conservative turnout in ’08.
Remember: The Democrats won on Tuesday by not running on a liberal agenda, unlike their attempts under Gephardt. The first time they sway from their (oddly) conservative tone the voters will punish them.
Side note: The term you’re looking for isn’t ‘troll’, it’s ‘master’.
James, there have been a lot more than just three elections…do you remember how the Dems (especially Clinton) acted in ’96?
James,
You sure are a funny guy! The conservative vote? That’s what the Republicans were counting on Tuesday. Guess what, it didn’t materialize, quite the opposite in fact. Even worse, independents have left the republican party. EVEN WORSE, there is no longer a leadership of the Republican party, they are all in jail, or headed to jail. The Democrats are going to ask a lot of embarrassing questions over the next two years. It will take you at least a decade to repair those two fundamental failings of the republican party this election cycle. Furthermore, all the lobbyists who have bankrolled the Republican party for the last 12 years, they are all looking for new jobs today. They have all been told they are no longer allowed to write the legislation that they want. I am sure at least some of the new lobbyists coming into DC, are going to get the same message the current crop got in 94. “If you even talk to the guys on other side of aisle, you get nothing” There are still a lot of bitter feelings for all the bipartisan blather. That is why, Bush’s very first act on Wednesday morning, was to take action that will ultimately end the Iraq conflict. Even worse for Bush and Republicans, the media in that presser seemed free to ask any question, no matter how much it might insult Bush.
Simply put, we didn’t simply win, we crushed the Republican party. A Disaster. And I simply don’t see the current crop of Democrats making the same mistakes this congress made any time soon.
I’m not going to predict the presidential outcome in 08, but congress will remain in Democrat hands for at least a decade. In 08 the Republicans have an uphill battle for presidency, using pure electoral politics. Ohio, and Montana seem to be Blue states now. Rather than campaigning for 08, I might suggest 12 is a better target. That is if you can accept defeat, and cut the regressive views of your party out of the republican platform. I might suggest starting by getting rid of all the fundamentalist, repressed closeted gay, drug abusing, gambling, bribe taking Republicans. The longer longer it takes you to exorcise those demons, the longer you will remain…
The Minority Party.
I might suggest a primer of the 5 stages of grief. Right now you are in denial.
Just back from lunch, and had my daily dose of Limbaugh. (He’s a riot…in small doses) Coincidentally James, he said exactly the same thing you wrote about lawyers, etc.
Coincidental, I’m sure. 😉
25
It wasn’t about the “come home to roost on this one” part, it was about the “this chickens have really” part. Obviously.
And what the hell is a dittohead? Can you neo-con (proud to say, that is the first time I have ever used that word) nutbags invent anymore moonbat words?
#25 Side note: The term you’re looking for isn’t ‘troll’, it’s ‘master’.
Comment by James Hill — 11/9/2006 @ 7:37 am
Really? Did they recently update the definition of master to include “partisan hack”?
22 This election doesn’t prove anything one way or the other. Maybe the Democrats hacked the machines, and that’s why they won. Maybe the Republicans AND the Dems hacked the machines, and cancelled each other out. And maybe the Republicans hacked them, but didn’t hack enough.
Agreed. Lots of possibilities.
One of my favorites: Whoever in Diebold controls their eVote machines decided that Republican wins – after all that negative publicity – would be challenged.
What better way to relieve fears than letting the other side win during a mid-term election?
Give’em a false sense of security leading-up to the big show?
Make sure the hacks work as intended, with no slip-ups…
… tin-foil hats are addicitive. 🙂